Australia news May 15, 2012

Johnson may have to wait his turn - Arthur

ESPNcricinfo staff
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Australia's coach Micky Arthur has said Mitchell Johnson will have to compete with Pat Cummins for a place in the starting XI during the one-day series against Ireland and England in June and July.

Both Johnson and Cummins were recalled to the squad after recovering from foot injuries they sustained during Australia's Test tour of South Africa in November 2011. "Mitchell Johnson returns and we can't wait to have him back around the group," Arthur said. "He may have to wait his turn though, as we are taking such a talented group of bowlers on the tour with us."

Arthur said he was excited with the prospect of seeing Cummins, who took seven wickets on Test debut against South Africa last November, return to top-flight cricket. "The player I am most excited about is Pat Cummins, we all saw what he could do in his one and only Test match and to have him back in the mix is fantastic," he said. "He has the ability to become one of the best in the world. He and Patto [James Pattinson] will take a huge amount out of this tour."

Arthur hoped the Pattinson-Cummins combination would make their attack a force during the Ashes in 2013. "We hope they both will be firing this time next year when we go to England to claim the Ashes back and drawing on the experience of touring the UK before will certainly give them an edge."

Arthur also expressed support for Australia's Test batting line up. "I am very happy with where our Test team is headed. Continuity in selection and role clarity is so important in creating team culture and I know that all players now know where and how they fit in," he said. "We have a settled top six now and, together, this unit has played seven Test matches."

Edited by Carlyle Laurie

Comments have now been closed for this article

  • POSTED BY Meety on | May 17, 2012, 6:26 GMT

    @Wefinishthis - firstly, the point is mate you said "...Both of them were useless in the past 2 ashes..." - which clearly was not the case. Oz got done over in 10/11, however, to be fair BOTH Hilfy & Siddle had either been carrying or recuperating from reasonably serious injuries. Whilst I agree that over time averages are very important in rating a player, consider in 2009 that Broad averaged 30, Swann 40, Anderson 45, Flintoff 50+, Harmison 33. Which puts Hilfy & siddle's 27 & 31 in better light - doesn't it? You talk about being a "dominate" bowler required to win back the Ashes, answer me how did England win it back with those bowlers? ( I Didn't mention that Onions ave was 30). All 3 of Oz's leading wicket takers (MJ was 3rd), all had sub 50 S/Rates, which is historically a "dominate" stat), in 2009, only Onions was sub 50 for England! So both Siddle & Hilfy had one good & one poor series v England, they SHOULD be given a chance for one more shot IMO.

  • POSTED BY hris on | May 17, 2012, 4:40 GMT

    would love to see a day with Pattinson and Starc opening the bowling with Cummins at first change. Hope that would be the heart of our team going forward. Batting look pretty dodgy to me. Need some quality test players. Frankly there arent too many. Most of them old, like dussey,mussey, rogers. Young ones havent made the jump over to test cricket(khawaja, hughes). Maddinson, Lynn have also been a bit disappointing. Hope some of them imporve. Or maybe we should think about trying Kurtis Patterson. he look promising.

  • POSTED BY popcorn on | May 17, 2012, 1:19 GMT

    Mitchell johnson can be devastatingly lethal at trimes, and wayward at other times.Unless he changes his shoulder action to become consistent,he cannot be chosen over the consistent Pat Cummins.Or Mitchell Starc.

  • POSTED BY Wefinishthis on | May 17, 2012, 0:18 GMT

    I agree with so many comments here. Meety it may be true that they took the majority of the wickets, but that means nothing if they got smashed for plenty of runs per wicket and this is why averages are so important. For a series, by Australian bowling standards, anything between 15-20 is outstanding, 20-25 is very good, 25-30 is respectable, 30-35 is average and 35+ is very poor. Hilfenhaus in England 2009 avg 27.5, Hilfenhaus in Australia 2010 avg 59, Siddle in England 2009 avg 29.5, Siddle in Australia 2010 avg 34.5. So the reality is that against England, Hilfenhaus and Siddle are simply not good enough to dominate. Now they may deserve another chance because since McDermott got them bowling fuller they've regained some confidence, but if they can't dominate England in the first 2 games, then they should be dropped for all of eternity. To get back to no.1 and dominate, we're going to need a brilliant bowler like McGrath/Philander/Steyn, not average bowlers like Siddle and Hilfy.

  • POSTED BY Meety on | May 16, 2012, 23:52 GMT

    @Always-positive - gee you really don't live up to your tag name! LOL! @katandthat3 - well said (although I would say I'm a fence sitter re: Arthurs), I do think that Arthurs HAS to say that, I think given batsmen can sometimes only have ONE chance to get things right, they don't need to be needlessly looking over their shoulder. There is obviously going to be at least TWO age related changes to the Oz side within the next TWO years (possibly sooner), we have an allrounder who doesn't really know where he is best suited, & an opener who still a fledgling, I would say the only TWO batsmen who have a long Test career still ahead of them are Clarke & Warner. I include Warner as unless his scores read like binary code against the Saffas & Lankans next summer, he is on the plane to England for the Ashes. @landl47/Sir Viv - name ONE instance on this thread where any Ozzy (or for that matter anyone) - where anybody has said that Cummins is anything other than a TALENT?????

  • POSTED BY katandthat3 on | May 16, 2012, 21:21 GMT

    I'm a big fan of Micky Arthur but there is no way the top 6 for Australia is settled. As coach he has to come out and back his players and would naturally feel that by backing them publicly that it'll take the heat off them a little and possibly get the best out of them over the next 12 months. However there are some big series coming up on very different surfaces and would like to see a broad view on selection to give us the best results. If Ponting has a big summer he'd be pretty valuable in India along with Hussey and Clarke. Still unsure about Warner, Cowan and Watson as our top 3 in Indian and UK conditions. Very interested to see how the A tour goes, particularly Joe Burns who I'm glad to see get picked. Also how guys like Khawaja, Marsh and Hughes go with their respective counties. There will still be many adjustments. As for bowlers, no problems, yes it's early days in Cummins career but from what I've seen he's the best prospect, see how his young body goes, no rush though.

  • POSTED BY SirViv1973 on | May 16, 2012, 16:27 GMT

    @land47, your comments regarding PC are spot on. I totally agree that he is a great prospect and even though i'm a pom part of me does want him to fufil his potential but from the comments on here from some of our oz cousins and the usual (we hate Eng gang from the sub cont) they seem to have already decided that he will deliver the ashes for OZ in 2013. As has been pointed out this is a 19 yr old rookie who has played 4 1st class games & a handful of t20 matches. In my experinece bowlers have to learn their trade look at the way Anderson bursted on the scene a decade ago, he had a handful of 1st class games for lancs and did well initially but needed to go back to county cricket to hone his skills, the same can be said of SB & another is Zaheer who after a very promising start for Ind was dropped then had a yr at Worcester which turned out to be the making of him. At this stage I would say Starc is a better prospect for 2013 than PC as he looks like hes a bit more devolped

  • POSTED BY SnowSnake on | May 16, 2012, 16:19 GMT

    Johnson should pursue other career alternatives. He is OK but Australia has better options.

  • POSTED BY AKS286 on | May 16, 2012, 14:06 GMT

    haha cummins will do nothing in ashes go for mJ

  • POSTED BY Mustapha8220 on | May 16, 2012, 13:20 GMT

    U can't judge someone playing just one test match, Mitch is a very useful player in any playing eleven!!

  • POSTED BY Meety on | May 17, 2012, 6:26 GMT

    @Wefinishthis - firstly, the point is mate you said "...Both of them were useless in the past 2 ashes..." - which clearly was not the case. Oz got done over in 10/11, however, to be fair BOTH Hilfy & Siddle had either been carrying or recuperating from reasonably serious injuries. Whilst I agree that over time averages are very important in rating a player, consider in 2009 that Broad averaged 30, Swann 40, Anderson 45, Flintoff 50+, Harmison 33. Which puts Hilfy & siddle's 27 & 31 in better light - doesn't it? You talk about being a "dominate" bowler required to win back the Ashes, answer me how did England win it back with those bowlers? ( I Didn't mention that Onions ave was 30). All 3 of Oz's leading wicket takers (MJ was 3rd), all had sub 50 S/Rates, which is historically a "dominate" stat), in 2009, only Onions was sub 50 for England! So both Siddle & Hilfy had one good & one poor series v England, they SHOULD be given a chance for one more shot IMO.

  • POSTED BY hris on | May 17, 2012, 4:40 GMT

    would love to see a day with Pattinson and Starc opening the bowling with Cummins at first change. Hope that would be the heart of our team going forward. Batting look pretty dodgy to me. Need some quality test players. Frankly there arent too many. Most of them old, like dussey,mussey, rogers. Young ones havent made the jump over to test cricket(khawaja, hughes). Maddinson, Lynn have also been a bit disappointing. Hope some of them imporve. Or maybe we should think about trying Kurtis Patterson. he look promising.

  • POSTED BY popcorn on | May 17, 2012, 1:19 GMT

    Mitchell johnson can be devastatingly lethal at trimes, and wayward at other times.Unless he changes his shoulder action to become consistent,he cannot be chosen over the consistent Pat Cummins.Or Mitchell Starc.

  • POSTED BY Wefinishthis on | May 17, 2012, 0:18 GMT

    I agree with so many comments here. Meety it may be true that they took the majority of the wickets, but that means nothing if they got smashed for plenty of runs per wicket and this is why averages are so important. For a series, by Australian bowling standards, anything between 15-20 is outstanding, 20-25 is very good, 25-30 is respectable, 30-35 is average and 35+ is very poor. Hilfenhaus in England 2009 avg 27.5, Hilfenhaus in Australia 2010 avg 59, Siddle in England 2009 avg 29.5, Siddle in Australia 2010 avg 34.5. So the reality is that against England, Hilfenhaus and Siddle are simply not good enough to dominate. Now they may deserve another chance because since McDermott got them bowling fuller they've regained some confidence, but if they can't dominate England in the first 2 games, then they should be dropped for all of eternity. To get back to no.1 and dominate, we're going to need a brilliant bowler like McGrath/Philander/Steyn, not average bowlers like Siddle and Hilfy.

  • POSTED BY Meety on | May 16, 2012, 23:52 GMT

    @Always-positive - gee you really don't live up to your tag name! LOL! @katandthat3 - well said (although I would say I'm a fence sitter re: Arthurs), I do think that Arthurs HAS to say that, I think given batsmen can sometimes only have ONE chance to get things right, they don't need to be needlessly looking over their shoulder. There is obviously going to be at least TWO age related changes to the Oz side within the next TWO years (possibly sooner), we have an allrounder who doesn't really know where he is best suited, & an opener who still a fledgling, I would say the only TWO batsmen who have a long Test career still ahead of them are Clarke & Warner. I include Warner as unless his scores read like binary code against the Saffas & Lankans next summer, he is on the plane to England for the Ashes. @landl47/Sir Viv - name ONE instance on this thread where any Ozzy (or for that matter anyone) - where anybody has said that Cummins is anything other than a TALENT?????

  • POSTED BY katandthat3 on | May 16, 2012, 21:21 GMT

    I'm a big fan of Micky Arthur but there is no way the top 6 for Australia is settled. As coach he has to come out and back his players and would naturally feel that by backing them publicly that it'll take the heat off them a little and possibly get the best out of them over the next 12 months. However there are some big series coming up on very different surfaces and would like to see a broad view on selection to give us the best results. If Ponting has a big summer he'd be pretty valuable in India along with Hussey and Clarke. Still unsure about Warner, Cowan and Watson as our top 3 in Indian and UK conditions. Very interested to see how the A tour goes, particularly Joe Burns who I'm glad to see get picked. Also how guys like Khawaja, Marsh and Hughes go with their respective counties. There will still be many adjustments. As for bowlers, no problems, yes it's early days in Cummins career but from what I've seen he's the best prospect, see how his young body goes, no rush though.

  • POSTED BY SirViv1973 on | May 16, 2012, 16:27 GMT

    @land47, your comments regarding PC are spot on. I totally agree that he is a great prospect and even though i'm a pom part of me does want him to fufil his potential but from the comments on here from some of our oz cousins and the usual (we hate Eng gang from the sub cont) they seem to have already decided that he will deliver the ashes for OZ in 2013. As has been pointed out this is a 19 yr old rookie who has played 4 1st class games & a handful of t20 matches. In my experinece bowlers have to learn their trade look at the way Anderson bursted on the scene a decade ago, he had a handful of 1st class games for lancs and did well initially but needed to go back to county cricket to hone his skills, the same can be said of SB & another is Zaheer who after a very promising start for Ind was dropped then had a yr at Worcester which turned out to be the making of him. At this stage I would say Starc is a better prospect for 2013 than PC as he looks like hes a bit more devolped

  • POSTED BY SnowSnake on | May 16, 2012, 16:19 GMT

    Johnson should pursue other career alternatives. He is OK but Australia has better options.

  • POSTED BY AKS286 on | May 16, 2012, 14:06 GMT

    haha cummins will do nothing in ashes go for mJ

  • POSTED BY Mustapha8220 on | May 16, 2012, 13:20 GMT

    U can't judge someone playing just one test match, Mitch is a very useful player in any playing eleven!!

  • POSTED BY landl47 on | May 16, 2012, 12:39 GMT

    @Marcio: Broad's average is 31, within a few percentage points of Mitch Johnson's. However, Broad is only 25 now. If you look at the last 2 years, from ages 23-25, Broad averages 26.4, against Pakistan and Sri Lanka (2 series each), Australia and India. In the same period, Johnson (ages 28-30 during the period) averages 45.7. As I said in another post, Broad had to learn to bowl. Johnson never did learn, which is why he shouldn't be in the side now.

  • POSTED BY landl47 on | May 16, 2012, 12:25 GMT

    It's interesting to see the comments in response to mine about Cummins. I'm not doubting his ability, but an awful lot of people are projecting their hopes onto him at an age when he has very little experience to fall back on when the going gets tough- as it will. At the moment almost everything he does is what he does naturally. To say he understands how to use his talents at this age is a joke, in my view; I've never seen any young fast bowler in my 50+ years of watching cricket who didn't have to learn, and that includes Lillee, Thomson, all the great WI quicks, Imran, Wasim and Waqar, McGrath, Richard Hadlee Peter and Shaun Pollock and Steyn (whose first series, against England in 2004/5, saw him take 8 wickets @50 each and earned him a rest from the team for a year). Zaheer Khan was a very ordinary bowler until, as he says himself, he spent time in county cricket learning to bowl. I'm not knocking Cummins, but give him time.

  • POSTED BY Always-positive on | May 16, 2012, 12:00 GMT

    The Australian bowling stock is so bad at the moment, they just pick who happens to have taken some wickets last 1st class game. I would rate them below New Zealand at the moment.

  • POSTED BY VillageBlacksmith on | May 16, 2012, 11:14 GMT

    Cummins was bowled into the ground by Clarke because the other bowlers did not back him up. And BTW Mickey ''Mouse'' Arthur couldn't even drive a coach, he had more talent @ RSA and failed, and he will fail again with oz. His ''settled top 6'' comment and his confused statement on Johnson shows his thin grasp of reality. Prob why a good coach like McDermott left

  • POSTED BY Harry_Kool on | May 16, 2012, 11:08 GMT

    Sriraj G.S.. Cummins was just rolling his arm over in the U19 tourney, the selectors wanted him to have match practice. Not a world beater? Do yourself a favour and go look up the highlights of his test debut against the Saffers & watch how Kallis handled him. No Indian bowler or Harry Conway would ever do that to him. He has the goods, no doubt about that. And don't forget one of his fc games was the Shield final in Hobart where the locals prepared a road. I would have him in my side rather than face him any time. And he will only get better, faster & stronger in the next few years. @landl47. Lillee terrorized England as a young tearaway bowler when first selected. It was only after his had his stress fracture that he learnt the subtle variations that completed him. The bowling isn't the concern, blind Freddie can see we need a few batsmen to put their hand up. Guys, give up on Warner bashing, I would also rather have him opening for us than facing him, we know what he can do!

  • POSTED BY fitzy99 on | May 16, 2012, 10:45 GMT

    Don't worry Mith you'll get your chance when Cummins is 35.......oh wait

  • POSTED BY Heisenburg on | May 16, 2012, 10:38 GMT

    Cummins shouldn't be playing tests just yet, he's to fragile, should only be playing ODI and T20.

  • POSTED BY dinosaurus on | May 16, 2012, 10:37 GMT

    I just hope the England players have the same view of Johnson as the English contributors here! He'll have to prove himself to get the chance to play, but I am confident he can do it.

  • POSTED BY Moppa on | May 16, 2012, 10:26 GMT

    @landl47, generally your comments are pretty much spot on, but I don't think you've got Cummins quite right. He is not just about express pace and nothing else (when he took 6 for at Jo'burg he was tiring and often bowling < 140kph) Actually his best weapon is his natural bowling instincts and tactics: mixing up shorter balls within an attack that is generally well-pitched up at the top of off, and a touch of movement. (McDermott would approve). I don't think he's as fast as Brett Lee at the same age, but is probably eight years ahead of Lee's learning curve in terms of bowling smarts. The comparison with Broad is useful, but works against your argument. Broad went from woefully bad to devastating in one test match (the Oval 2009) when he suddenly decided to pitch it up. Cummins has already learned what length to target. Re Johnson, he's a proven performer in Test cricket - proven to be unreliable. I can tolerate him in ODIs, but please never again in Tests!

  • POSTED BY Keepa-batsman on | May 16, 2012, 9:58 GMT

    johnson should never play for australia again. one of the reasons our bowlers going so well vs india is that he wasnt down the other end taking pressure of by bowling rubbish. Pattinson, cummins, siddle, hilfenhaus, starc, bollinger, coulternile,harris,cutting should all be ahead of him

  • POSTED BY Dashgar on | May 16, 2012, 7:43 GMT

    @Landl, you can only pick from the cattle you've got. Australia are currently playing with their best 6 batsmen and are winning test matches. We'll have tougher tests than India at home and the West Indies true but unless another player actually stands out and performs better than these guys then they won't make the team. The only guy who is close to matching these 6's performances is Rob Quiney and he isn't even in the Aus A squad.

  • POSTED BY jonesy2 on | May 16, 2012, 7:40 GMT

    i would love to know how mitch marsh is coming along with his injury....

    landl47 -- you obviously know nothing about pat cummins and have never watched him play.

  • POSTED BY Meety on | May 16, 2012, 7:17 GMT

    @Marcio - well said, on all counts. Regarding Finn, almost HALF of his Test wickets are against Bangladesh! Regarding Cummins, he is undoubtably one of the most talented prospects Oz have ever uncovered, the issue is of course whether he fulfills that promise, which is something only time will really tell. @landl47 - I know where you are coming from & agree that to hand the Ashes mission in his hands of Cummins is far too much. I do disagree though that there can be any comparison between Cummins & Broad, different type of players (although Cummins MAY in the future be considered an allrounder), there is distinct differences in method & raw pace & progression for age. @Micky.Panda - I think MJ was ready for test cricket, however feel he went from member of the pace to spearhead too soon, (when Lee AND Clark faltered with injury, he would of been so much better having two yrs under them). @Wefinishthis - Siddle & Hilfy topped the wicket takers list for BOTH sides in 2009 Ashes!

  • POSTED BY Meety on | May 16, 2012, 7:06 GMT

    @SirViv1973 - just the same - there is no guarantee that any of the Pommy pacers you mentioned will ALL be fit. Eg: Brenan, Tremlett & Broad have all been injured RECENTLY, with Broad prone to injury & Finn couldn't handle back to back Ashes tests a couple of years ago either! @Adrian Meredith - true, Cummins FC career is not spectacular - yet, however the anecdotal evidence of batsmen that have played against him suggests the results will come. He was reported to have bowled without luck in the Shield Final 14mths or so ago. @the_blue_android - series India did not "end" MJ or Lee's career. Dunno if you just worded that comment wrong or what - but it is plain wrong. @Behind_the_bowlers_arm - yep the "A" tour will be one of the most scrutinised low profile series ever! @Siraj G.S - whether Cummins proves himself in the future is subject to conjecture. What is NOT, is the fact that it was really a glorified net session for Cummins during the Quadrangular.

  • POSTED BY SirViv1973 on | May 16, 2012, 6:34 GMT

    @Rooboy Watson is not a front line bowler! he has only taken 59 wickets and taken them in clusters 13 of which came in 2 tests in 2010 and has always had the luxury of bowling in a 5 or 6 man attack! The 2 bowlers who you elude to are Anderson & Broad, Anderson has 258 test wickets & Broad has 147. Nobody in there right mind could say Watson is a better bowler than either of these guys.

  • POSTED BY Wefinishthis on | May 16, 2012, 6:22 GMT

    I don't want to see Johnson back in the side (apart from perhaps a game in Perth) but I don't want to see Hilfenhaus or Siddle either, despite them doing alright against a few lacklustre opponents like India, WI and NZ. Both of them were useless in the past 2 ashes so I don't see how they'll do any better this time around other than McDermott's influence. The English have never faced Pattinson, Cummins or Lyon (statistically one of the best spinners in the world currently) and Harris was quality against them (as he has been against all opposition), so the Pattinson/Harris/Cummins/Lyon combination is the real key to containing the class of Cook and Trott. Our batting lineup is still a concern however. Having Wade/Nevill as our keeper will be good and Warner may win a game or two for us, so that's something they haven't faced before either. I think our best chance would be: Warner, Rogers, Clarke, D.Hussey, M.Hussey, Watson, Wade, Pattinson, Harris, Lyon, Cummins.

  • POSTED BY johntycodes on | May 16, 2012, 5:54 GMT

    I'm an aussie so I would like nothing more than for cummins to be a great bowler but he is overrated. He had 1 good game on the most seamer friendly pitch you will see.

  • POSTED BY CricketRealFan on | May 16, 2012, 5:13 GMT

    @Micky Arthur: Its simple Johnson is already tested and we know how danger he is..... Comparing Johnson with newcomer Cummins is not fair at all.

    See the stats below...

    Johnson:

    Mat Inns Balls Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 4w 5w 10 Tests 47 89 10672 5946 190 8/61 11/159 31.29 3.34 56.1 10 7 2 ODIs 107 105 5234 4237 168 6/31 6/31 25. 22 4.85 31.1 6 3 0 T20Is 28 28 608 724 36 3/15 3/15 20. 11 7.14 16.8 0 0 0

    Cummins

    Mat Inns Balls Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 4w 5w 10 Tests 1 2 264 117 7 6/79 7/117 16.71 2.65 37.7 0 1 0 ODIs 3 3 138 150 5 3/28 3/28 30.00 6.52 27.6 0 0 0 T20Is 2 2 48 52 5 3/25 3/25 10.40 6.50 9.6 0 0 0

  • POSTED BY anver777 on | May 16, 2012, 4:45 GMT

    Johnson is very experienced & hope he will be back strongly in the middle of the series !!!!

  • POSTED BY landl47 on | May 16, 2012, 4:25 GMT

    Sometimes it's hard to know whether Mickey Arthur is being serious. Aus has a settled top 6? The top 3, in 92 innings between them, have the grand total of 4 centuries. Cowan's test average is 29, Warner's 42 and Watson's 38. Numbers 4 and 6, on the other hand, are at the end of their careers- Ponting's 37 and Hussey will be 37 on May 27. It's just a question of which series will prove to be their last. If that's his idea of a settled top 6, then Mickey Arthur should be fired. He needs quality players to replace those who aren't good enough or are too old and he needs them NOW, not in two years' time. Some runs against the popgun attacks of NZ, India and WI doesn't hide the fact that this is an Aus batting line-up with a lot of problems..

  • POSTED BY Micky.Panda on | May 16, 2012, 4:13 GMT

    In reply to "I don't know how CA managed to mess up MJ's career." Johnson was selected for Aus before he was ready. He wasn't really good enough. He only ever really performed in about one series. He fell into prime bowling spot when Lee got injured. He still probably isn't good enough. Doesn't have the ball control required. Both Cummins and Johnson really need to prove form before being selected. Johnson will not be needed for tests unless lots of others are injured. I think Hilfy is the clear number one consistent performer right now. He has proven improvement and good form. Patto and Cummins have potential but have to prove they can keep doing it. Harris and Siddle are both still in front of Johnson. I think picking Johnson is like saying "Lets just see if he has anything to offer at all" in less important matches. Starc is probably going to be better than Johnson. For one-day matches have Lee, McKay, and all rounders like Watson, Christian, etc. How can Johnson be picked?

  • POSTED BY landl47 on | May 16, 2012, 2:02 GMT

    Cummins is an exciting prospect, but he's 19 years old and has played 4 first-class games (including one test) and taken 16 FC wickets @33 each. To start putting the return of the Ashes on him and Pattinson is way too much pressure. Test batsmen will work him out (speed alone isn't enough at test level) and he'll have to learn to bowl effectively. Stuart Broad came up with exactly the same hoopla and it was 5 years before he became a really effective test bowler, although he always showed flashes of promise.The same was true of Dennis Lillee, the best true fast bowler I have seen, who needed several years before getting to his peak- during which time Australia failed to recover the Ashes in 1972. If he stays fit I have no doubt Cummins will have a great test career, but don't be surprised if he has a quiet time first.

  • POSTED BY Rooboy on | May 16, 2012, 1:29 GMT

    Uhhh ... SirViv1973 ... this Watson guy, the batsman who bowls a bit, has a better test bowling average than 2 of the 'proven test match performers' in the bowling attack you'd prefer to have.

  • POSTED BY Marcio on | May 16, 2012, 1:06 GMT

    Cummins is no "one test wonder", as someone below put it. Anyone who has watched him bowl regularly knows that he is a real talent. Assuming he stays fit, he should have a wonderful international career. But he is only 18, so there's no need to push him.

  • POSTED BY Marcio on | May 16, 2012, 1:03 GMT

    @ SirViv1973 "compare that to Anderson,Broad, Bresnan,Finn & Tremlett all proven test match performers I know which attack I would prefer to have!" You are joking, right? Of that mob only Anderson is a world class bowler, and even then only in certain conditions - look at his performances in India, SL and vs PAK. The rest are either inexperienced or "promising". Broad averages about 35 runs a wicket, way more than any of the Aussie bowlers. Tremlett had one good half-series: The Ashes. Finn got dropped, and is yet to fully prove himself. Bresnan is a good bowler, but he's about the same class as ,say, Peter Siddle: an honest toiler. The most notable thing about the English fastbowling attack is not raw ability, but discipline and teamwork, and having a top class spinner like Graham Swann to work in with.

  • POSTED BY chicko1983 on | May 15, 2012, 23:09 GMT

    anyone who is doubting cummins needs to watch the shield final he played as a 17 or 18 year old. only took one wicket but that was because he missed the bat about a dozen times as it was too good. Also, watch the working over he gave Jaques Kallis. Kallis a pretty good player, Cummins made him look ordinary.

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 23:03 GMT

    I am not at all convinced that Pat Cummins is yet a world-beater. He gets impressive bounce and had a wonderful test debut. But his performances in the recent U19 Quadrangular were totally underwhelming. He was outbowled by Gurinder Sandhu and Harry Conway and the batsmen didn't really struggle against his pace. Only his batting was a plus. I sincerely hope he has recovered 100% before being blooded on an int'l tour right away!

  • POSTED BY Behind_the_bowlers_arm on | May 15, 2012, 22:47 GMT

    I'm guessing Cummins might be given 2 or 3 of the 5 ODI's and then be combined with Pattinson & Starc for the longer form games against the England Lions. Australia are still in the mode of using ODI's to rotate bowlers and it wont be til after the 2013 Ashes that its worth even thinking about the 2015 World Cup. The big part of this summer for Australia is the performance of the batsmen in English conditions. Joe Burns, Cowan, Peter Forrest etc in the A team have a big test and opportunity.

  • POSTED BY the_blue_android on | May 15, 2012, 22:47 GMT

    I don't know how CA managed to mess up MJ's career. Of course if it was an Indian bowler like Ishant losing his way due to poor BCCI, that is very understandable. If Starc can improve his bowling by talking to Wasim for 30 mins, why can't MJ? MJ's problems purely seem to be technical and still no one is able to figure it out! Why can't he swing the ball back in for right handers? Any bowler breaking Graeme smith's thumb and making Kallis bleed has got to be a good bowler! As far as Cummins and Pattinson are concerned, they have to be guaged only after a series in India. Series in India ended Lee's and MJ's career not because of our 'great' batsmen, but because of the dead pitches.

  • POSTED BY MinusZero on | May 15, 2012, 22:39 GMT

    I still dont know how Johnson or Cummins can be picked when they havent played for 6 months.

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 21:18 GMT

    I am not convinced that Pat Cummins is good enough. After 1 test he is still an unknown commodity and his FC career suggests he may be a one test wonder.

  • POSTED BY SirViv1973 on | May 15, 2012, 21:11 GMT

    @Fronald chettier, I thought MJ had already been ruled out of the IPL & replaced by Dwayne Smith ?

  • POSTED BY SirViv1973 on | May 15, 2012, 21:07 GMT

    @nandwani88, I'm not sure that group of bowlers will ever be fit at the same time so from oz point of view they may well still need Johnson in the future don't forget how good he was when he first came on the scene in 07/08 and the fact he has to fight for his place for the first time may bring the best out of him. I think you also have a short memory Eng batsmen destroyed Hilfenhaus & Siddle during the last ashes series, Harris is fragile and theres a good chance he wont even be around come the next series. Pattinson does look good & although he is a good prospect Cummins has only played a handful of 1st class games & will need to stay fit & properly learn his trade before he can realise his potential & I dont think he will do that by the next ashes & Watson is a batsman who bowls a bit! compare that to Anderson,Broad, Bresnan,Finn & Tremlett all proven test match performers I know which attack I would prefer to have!

  • POSTED BY mukesh_LOVE.cricket on | May 15, 2012, 20:50 GMT

    Pat cummins ,james pattinson , starc all fantastic talents ,along with ryan harris and hilfenhaus there is enough firepower to knock down any team anywhere , whether they can back it up with the bat remains to be seen.. anyway exciting times ahead in world cricket

  • POSTED BY Beertjie on | May 15, 2012, 20:49 GMT

    The quality of the pace stocks is a no-brainer. But Oz needs another quality spinner since Lyon has no back up. Beer would never make an impression in India or in the Ashes. This could be decisive in a close fought series, so this is the real undercurrent going into the next Oz season. People need to put their hands up and picking on "potential" is a real banana skin lying in waiting as it was before. I can foresee any number of picks being touted to fill such roles, e.g., Steve Smith.

  • POSTED BY Mervo on | May 15, 2012, 20:17 GMT

    Johnson will come back. He has 190 Test wickets at an average that would see him as the opening bowler for most countries. However, it is his Test batting average of 22 that is the clincher. Pattinson will have a short career with many injuries and Cummins is a one test wonder with huge question marks. Lots of trash talk here. Wickets and experience count, history tells us.

  • POSTED BY dsig3 on | May 15, 2012, 19:01 GMT

    Will be interesting to see how he comes back. To me, Johnson has always lacked a competitive ruthlessness. He was very close to being forced to resume his career of driving a plumbers truck. It would be nice to see him come back a tad hungrier and nastier. He still has a role in the squad, its just not as a spearhead. A nasty, slingy, left arm quick who targets the body would be a good option to have when conditions suit.

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 18:45 GMT

    it will be good news for mumbai indians in playofffs

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 18:24 GMT

    Well if Mitchell Johnson is fit enough to play then he might be probably available for the Mumbai Indians in their closing games........that could be very good news for the Mumbai team and boost up their performance

  • POSTED BY Rally_Windies on | May 15, 2012, 18:21 GMT

    The heavy work load required of fast bowlers is ridiculous .....

    there is more than enough games for 5-6 bowlers to be rotated ...

    unless Australia can come up with a good spinner (as SA uses Tahir) to take a huge chunk of the work load as the spinner can take 15 over spells resting up the pacers....

    4 quicks is going to result in breakdowns especially when teams so frequently cross 300 in the two opening innings .

  • POSTED BY nandwani88 on | May 15, 2012, 18:20 GMT

    Once the Aussies have Hilfenhaus, Siddle, Harris, Cummins, Pattinson, & Watson fit and available, the Ashes are theirs!!! Time to move on from Johnson

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 18:10 GMT

    Looking fwd to Pattinson-Cummins pair in 2013! Can they do a Lillee-Massie 1972 act?

  • POSTED BY hhillbumper on | May 15, 2012, 17:56 GMT

    if they stay healthy for more than 2 games then we will see.you don't win anything on paper

  • POSTED BY Peterincanada on | May 15, 2012, 15:56 GMT

    If he is happy with the top six he is too easily pleased. Warner and Cowan are unproven, Ponting and Hussey are on the downside of their careers. Only Clarke and Watson are in their prime and Watson still has something to prove at number 3. If indeed Australia are to win back the Ashes it will be their bowling rather than the batting that will do it.

  • POSTED BY RyanHarrisGreatCricketer on | May 15, 2012, 14:09 GMT

    i dont understand how johnson can compete with cummins for a spot cummins should be a regular in odi team cos he has a good change of pace and a NATURAL yorker dis is aus odi team wade, watson, marsh, clarke, david hussey, smith, mitch marsh, james faulkner, ryan harris, cummins and lyon

    and dont know what arthur means by this unit has played seven Test matches." marsh was dropped after india series and watson was put in at no.3 which is unacceptable because he is the most competent bloke in aus to attack opening bowlers

  • POSTED BY Dashgar on | May 15, 2012, 14:05 GMT

    James Pattinson and Pat Cummins (or Patto and Pat) are going to be a force for Australia in the years to come. They compliment each other perfectly with swing from Patto and bounce from Pat. Much like Steyn/Morkel and Anderson/Broad. Hopefully this series will be the first real taste we get of them in tandem.

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 13:56 GMT

    I can't quite comprehend what Arthur said. He said he can't wait to have Johnson, but then Johnson has to wait for his chance for ODI's.

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  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 13:56 GMT

    I can't quite comprehend what Arthur said. He said he can't wait to have Johnson, but then Johnson has to wait for his chance for ODI's.

  • POSTED BY Dashgar on | May 15, 2012, 14:05 GMT

    James Pattinson and Pat Cummins (or Patto and Pat) are going to be a force for Australia in the years to come. They compliment each other perfectly with swing from Patto and bounce from Pat. Much like Steyn/Morkel and Anderson/Broad. Hopefully this series will be the first real taste we get of them in tandem.

  • POSTED BY RyanHarrisGreatCricketer on | May 15, 2012, 14:09 GMT

    i dont understand how johnson can compete with cummins for a spot cummins should be a regular in odi team cos he has a good change of pace and a NATURAL yorker dis is aus odi team wade, watson, marsh, clarke, david hussey, smith, mitch marsh, james faulkner, ryan harris, cummins and lyon

    and dont know what arthur means by this unit has played seven Test matches." marsh was dropped after india series and watson was put in at no.3 which is unacceptable because he is the most competent bloke in aus to attack opening bowlers

  • POSTED BY Peterincanada on | May 15, 2012, 15:56 GMT

    If he is happy with the top six he is too easily pleased. Warner and Cowan are unproven, Ponting and Hussey are on the downside of their careers. Only Clarke and Watson are in their prime and Watson still has something to prove at number 3. If indeed Australia are to win back the Ashes it will be their bowling rather than the batting that will do it.

  • POSTED BY hhillbumper on | May 15, 2012, 17:56 GMT

    if they stay healthy for more than 2 games then we will see.you don't win anything on paper

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 18:10 GMT

    Looking fwd to Pattinson-Cummins pair in 2013! Can they do a Lillee-Massie 1972 act?

  • POSTED BY nandwani88 on | May 15, 2012, 18:20 GMT

    Once the Aussies have Hilfenhaus, Siddle, Harris, Cummins, Pattinson, & Watson fit and available, the Ashes are theirs!!! Time to move on from Johnson

  • POSTED BY Rally_Windies on | May 15, 2012, 18:21 GMT

    The heavy work load required of fast bowlers is ridiculous .....

    there is more than enough games for 5-6 bowlers to be rotated ...

    unless Australia can come up with a good spinner (as SA uses Tahir) to take a huge chunk of the work load as the spinner can take 15 over spells resting up the pacers....

    4 quicks is going to result in breakdowns especially when teams so frequently cross 300 in the two opening innings .

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 18:24 GMT

    Well if Mitchell Johnson is fit enough to play then he might be probably available for the Mumbai Indians in their closing games........that could be very good news for the Mumbai team and boost up their performance

  • POSTED BY on | May 15, 2012, 18:45 GMT

    it will be good news for mumbai indians in playofffs