England v South Africa, 4th NatWest ODI, Lord's September 2, 2012

Tredwell traditions leave South Africa stumped

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England 224 for 4 (Bell 88, Trott 48) beat South Africa 220 for 8 (Amla 45, Tredwell 3-35) by six wickets
Scorecard and ball-by-ball details

Stumped Kieswetter bowled Tredwell is hardly the commonest entry on England scorecards, but it dominated proceedings at Lord's as England took a 2-1 lead against South Africa in the NatWest series with one to play and as a result ensured they would complete the series at the top of the ODI rankings. India will have the opportunity to claim that status when they face England in January.

Three times, James Tredwell lured a South Africa batsman down the pitch and three times Craig Kieswetter completed a stumping. It was the first time an England wicketkeeper had pulled off three stumpings in a one-day international and it set them en route to a comprehensive six-wicket victory with 20 balls to spare.

Ian Bell, with 88 from 137 balls, ensured England's run chase would stay on course, a task not entirely straightforward with the floodlights piercing the gloom and mizzle causing a 20-minute stoppage. He fell with victory in sight, making room to cut Dale Steyn, South Africa's one bowler of menace, over the off side and edging to the wicketkeeper, his man-of-the-match award assured. Craig Kieswetter completed victory to cheers by depositing Steyn fox six into the pavilion.

Bell's Warwickshire team mate, Jonathan Trott offered, grim, indeed grimacing, support, in a second-wicket stand of 141 in 31 overs, batting on gamely for 48 after being struck on the hand during a fiery opening spell from Steyn, who also removed Alastair Cook lbw in his first over with a high-class inswinger. Trott, not as much as a Bear with a sore head as a Bear with a sore hand, will have a hospital scan on Monday morning.

Trott took a blow on the hand in Steyn's third over and needed pain-killing spray and tablets as he batted on manfully in obvious discomfort. One uppercut over point off Tsotsobe Lonwabo was followed by a curse at the discomfort and he settled for wise deflections thereafter. Not that it would have unduly bothered him.

Like Trott, Tredwell is a representative of an unglamorous species. His very appearance, unassuming in manner, deliberate in tread and economical of hair, accentuates the impression. He does not even deal in Graeme Swann's happy brand of kidology. But South Africa will give more attention to this thoughtful Kent cricketer after his figures of 3 for 34 gave England an advantage they never relinquished.

It was an influential toss for England to win on a murky, overcast September morning. Their catching and fielding was again sketchy, but at least the Tredwell/Kieswetter combination was working well. JP Duminy, who had looked fallible against Swann's off spin earlier in the summer, was the first batsman removed, in Tredwell's second over. Then he returned in his second spell to defeat de Villiers' expansive drive and extended the habit by finding appreciable turn past Wayne Parnell's outside edge.

Tredwell's success transformed his morning. He has the convivial air of a suburban doctor and any self-diagnosis changed from feeling decidedly poorly to tip-top condition. He began by dropping Hashim Amla at second slip, not a habit designed to make winning cricket matches any easier. Amla had 5 when Finn found the edge and Tredwell, fingers pointing downwards as the ball reached him at shoulder height, fumbled a chance he made more awkward than it might have been. England have been dropping Amla throughout the summer and have given him more than 500 additional runs since the start of the Test series. Here they also lose their review in attempting to have an lbw call overturned.

Ravi Bopara, who was unfortunate not to have Amla lbw, belatedly removed him for 45, seaming the ball back a little into the stumps as he defeated a loose drive. It was the sort of classically English late-season day when Bopara's wobbly medium pace had an influential role to play. But Bopara's batting was again found wanting, an unfocused innings ending cheaply when Ryan McLaren defeated a lethargic drive.

Tredwell, the latest addition to a rickety England close-catching cordon, also missed Graeme Smith at slip off Finn when Kieswetter dived across him and unsettled his view, the ball striking him on the body; they were a happier couple when they were a length of the pitch apart. Smith's reprieve was not too costly for England as Dernbach surprised him with a bouncer which he top-edged through to the keeper.

Once he and Amla departed, many who followed lacked the same threat. De Villiers, with 39 from 45 balls, got himself into a position to play a decisive innings before Tredwell pushed one a little wider for the stumping, but Faf du Plessis is horribly out of form as he proved when he unwisely tried to run a ball from Bopara against the Lord's slope.

Elgar is another South Africa batsman who has been inhibited in English conditions. His 35 occupied 59 balls before he tried to pull Finn's slower-ball bouncer and gloved to the keeper. Ryan McLaren was run out the next ball, Finn's disappointment when a good appeal for lbw was refused turning to delight when Dernbach dashed around the boundary at third man and hit the stumps direct.

That South Africa made as many as they did was largely thanks to a highly-imaginative unbeaten 31 from 20 balls by Robin Peterson, the highlight of which was a reverse hit over extra cover for six into the Grandstand. But South Africa's one-day side lacks the balance and certainty that the Test XI displayed so emphatically.

David Hopps is the UK editor of ESPNcricinfo

Comments have now been closed for this article

  • POSTED BY Meety on | September 5, 2012, 1:08 GMT

    @MartinC on (September 04 2012, 08:48 AM GMT) - well said!. If I remove my Ozzy bias, & only consider non-Ozzy batsmen. The best non-ozzy batsmen in my lifetime to watch (on pure artistic pleasure), were 1. Gower, 2. VVS, 3. Mo Azzer. With my blinkers back on, I'd have to say Mark Waugh was miles ahead of the lot of them! With regards to Gower, I don't think there has ever been a player that could hit a 4 thru the covers so gently, almost apologetically.

  • POSTED BY Meety on | September 5, 2012, 0:59 GMT

    @JG2704 on (September 04 2012, 07:21 AM GMT) - YES! BTW - my other post prior did not get posted, in that I said there is TWO reasons for the constant bagging of England's "League of Nations" line up. 1) England are winning & therefor we can't bag your mob on performance (there's also the small matter of a little urn), & 2) The incidences of foreign born players is quite high. Point TWO is legitimate, but is mainly because of point ONE, that is so rampant! @jmcilhinney - I would say that is good that England will probably win the ODI series, takes some bitterness out of the summer, but as it is played AFTER the Tests, I think some intent is missing from the Saffas. Don't get me wrong, I was stoked with Oz beating your mob 6-1 after that incident in the last test series in Oz, but I'd of preferred to swap the ODI result for the Test result!

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 14:24 GMT

    @Proteas-13thman on (September 04 2012, 11:24 AM GMT) Tsotsobe was number 1 in the world in this format when I looked a month or so ago. Re Levi , got to be honest he looked powerful but very limited and one dimensional as a batsman (very leg side) and don't think he'd do much. Also opening the inns is not where you've had a problem. Maybe they could play one less paceman and bring in a spinner. You mentioned Botha and Van Der Merwe is another guy I really like. Both offer better batting options than Parnell. Parnell at 7 seems a bit high up in the order for the modern game

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 4, 2012, 12:09 GMT

    @MartinC on (September 04 2012, 08:48 AM GMT), funny you should say that. Gower is my favourite batsman of all time. Like Bell, he may not have had the record that his apparent talent would suggest he should have but, as you say, he took "easy on the eye" to the extreme. Some batsman just look like they have more time than everyone else and Gower looked like he could take a nap between the bowler loosing the ball and his leaning on it to send it racing through the covers to the boundary.

  • POSTED BY Proteas-13thman on | September 4, 2012, 11:24 GMT

    It is hard to to support the South African ODI team when they are for some reason not fielding their strongest side. I truely hope they put ''give this guy a chance'' and experimentation out of the equation. Choose a team and stick with it. Levi should replace smith as the opening batsmen.HE is more talented in this format. Smith is great for test cricket but not one days. Also WAYNE PARNELL does not perform well enough and has been given enough chances. Elgar deserved a run at it and FAF has been disappointing once again....perhaps the same make it or leave attitude should be given to these players. Johan Botha should be included in the team as well as tsotsobe. De villiers should only bat at 4 if we bat first and at 6 if we are chasing a score. Albie morkel has been wasted and will now never reach his full potential ...SADLY~! colin ingram should be included. If we need to make qouta's then play robin petersen instead of Johan botha since he always gives 100% for the team...

  • POSTED BY SuperSharky on | September 4, 2012, 10:00 GMT

    Well played England. And Bell showed his brilliance again. Good knock from Trott and Kieswetter too. This Proteas team is good but not yet as good in limited overs as they were back in the day with Woolmer & Cronje. They are still seeking for the right combinations. I'm not sure if Wayne Parnell is up to par. I would replace him with Botha. Where is Johan Botha?? He uses to help the tail with his batting if the front men fell. And his economy is perfect for limited overs. Seriously, where is Johan Botha?? And it is strange that Albie Morkel doesn't get to play. If he is injured, then why not sent him home for rehabilitation???

  • POSTED BY MartinC on | September 4, 2012, 8:48 GMT

    @ashes61 - I love watching Bell bat as well but even he is put into the shade by David Gower in terms of being an artist at the crease and 'easy on the eye'.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 7:21 GMT

    @Meety on (September 04 2012, 00:58 AM GMT) re "England have always had foreign born cricketers in their test team, just atm - it is appears to be at record incidences." - I think another thing is it's more noticeable because we've been performing better in recent years than in the years of Smith,Lamb,Hick etc. Mind , if Trott doesn't play and if they decide to not use Dernbach in the next 1 we'll have only one non European born player in our side.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 7:15 GMT

    @jmcilhinney on (September 03 2012, 10:00 AM GMT) I guess you should have known better than to write a well constructed post like that. For the record I think Bell looks vulnerable defensively but far better when he comes out of his shell. Esp when he uses his feet. Please publish this time.This is getting annoying when a cricket fan's comms to another genuine fan don't get published. Especially when you see many of the posts which do get published

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 7:13 GMT

    @Guernica on (September 03 2012, 10:48 AM GMT) To be fair I don't think JB said it was SA fans who were ungracious

  • POSTED BY Meety on | September 5, 2012, 1:08 GMT

    @MartinC on (September 04 2012, 08:48 AM GMT) - well said!. If I remove my Ozzy bias, & only consider non-Ozzy batsmen. The best non-ozzy batsmen in my lifetime to watch (on pure artistic pleasure), were 1. Gower, 2. VVS, 3. Mo Azzer. With my blinkers back on, I'd have to say Mark Waugh was miles ahead of the lot of them! With regards to Gower, I don't think there has ever been a player that could hit a 4 thru the covers so gently, almost apologetically.

  • POSTED BY Meety on | September 5, 2012, 0:59 GMT

    @JG2704 on (September 04 2012, 07:21 AM GMT) - YES! BTW - my other post prior did not get posted, in that I said there is TWO reasons for the constant bagging of England's "League of Nations" line up. 1) England are winning & therefor we can't bag your mob on performance (there's also the small matter of a little urn), & 2) The incidences of foreign born players is quite high. Point TWO is legitimate, but is mainly because of point ONE, that is so rampant! @jmcilhinney - I would say that is good that England will probably win the ODI series, takes some bitterness out of the summer, but as it is played AFTER the Tests, I think some intent is missing from the Saffas. Don't get me wrong, I was stoked with Oz beating your mob 6-1 after that incident in the last test series in Oz, but I'd of preferred to swap the ODI result for the Test result!

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 14:24 GMT

    @Proteas-13thman on (September 04 2012, 11:24 AM GMT) Tsotsobe was number 1 in the world in this format when I looked a month or so ago. Re Levi , got to be honest he looked powerful but very limited and one dimensional as a batsman (very leg side) and don't think he'd do much. Also opening the inns is not where you've had a problem. Maybe they could play one less paceman and bring in a spinner. You mentioned Botha and Van Der Merwe is another guy I really like. Both offer better batting options than Parnell. Parnell at 7 seems a bit high up in the order for the modern game

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 4, 2012, 12:09 GMT

    @MartinC on (September 04 2012, 08:48 AM GMT), funny you should say that. Gower is my favourite batsman of all time. Like Bell, he may not have had the record that his apparent talent would suggest he should have but, as you say, he took "easy on the eye" to the extreme. Some batsman just look like they have more time than everyone else and Gower looked like he could take a nap between the bowler loosing the ball and his leaning on it to send it racing through the covers to the boundary.

  • POSTED BY Proteas-13thman on | September 4, 2012, 11:24 GMT

    It is hard to to support the South African ODI team when they are for some reason not fielding their strongest side. I truely hope they put ''give this guy a chance'' and experimentation out of the equation. Choose a team and stick with it. Levi should replace smith as the opening batsmen.HE is more talented in this format. Smith is great for test cricket but not one days. Also WAYNE PARNELL does not perform well enough and has been given enough chances. Elgar deserved a run at it and FAF has been disappointing once again....perhaps the same make it or leave attitude should be given to these players. Johan Botha should be included in the team as well as tsotsobe. De villiers should only bat at 4 if we bat first and at 6 if we are chasing a score. Albie morkel has been wasted and will now never reach his full potential ...SADLY~! colin ingram should be included. If we need to make qouta's then play robin petersen instead of Johan botha since he always gives 100% for the team...

  • POSTED BY SuperSharky on | September 4, 2012, 10:00 GMT

    Well played England. And Bell showed his brilliance again. Good knock from Trott and Kieswetter too. This Proteas team is good but not yet as good in limited overs as they were back in the day with Woolmer & Cronje. They are still seeking for the right combinations. I'm not sure if Wayne Parnell is up to par. I would replace him with Botha. Where is Johan Botha?? He uses to help the tail with his batting if the front men fell. And his economy is perfect for limited overs. Seriously, where is Johan Botha?? And it is strange that Albie Morkel doesn't get to play. If he is injured, then why not sent him home for rehabilitation???

  • POSTED BY MartinC on | September 4, 2012, 8:48 GMT

    @ashes61 - I love watching Bell bat as well but even he is put into the shade by David Gower in terms of being an artist at the crease and 'easy on the eye'.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 7:21 GMT

    @Meety on (September 04 2012, 00:58 AM GMT) re "England have always had foreign born cricketers in their test team, just atm - it is appears to be at record incidences." - I think another thing is it's more noticeable because we've been performing better in recent years than in the years of Smith,Lamb,Hick etc. Mind , if Trott doesn't play and if they decide to not use Dernbach in the next 1 we'll have only one non European born player in our side.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 7:15 GMT

    @jmcilhinney on (September 03 2012, 10:00 AM GMT) I guess you should have known better than to write a well constructed post like that. For the record I think Bell looks vulnerable defensively but far better when he comes out of his shell. Esp when he uses his feet. Please publish this time.This is getting annoying when a cricket fan's comms to another genuine fan don't get published. Especially when you see many of the posts which do get published

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 4, 2012, 7:13 GMT

    @Guernica on (September 03 2012, 10:48 AM GMT) To be fair I don't think JB said it was SA fans who were ungracious

  • POSTED BY Chris_P on | September 4, 2012, 1:14 GMT

    @jmcilhinney. Please don't encourage Randy. Makes our posting harder!..LOL

  • POSTED BY Meety on | September 4, 2012, 0:58 GMT

    @YorkshirePudding - btw, the USA could use the arguement that most of their ex-pats "learned" their game in the USA as they have represented the US at U19s level. Sounds familiar? @Long-Leg - I think your definition of "developed" is dubious to say the least. County cricket is a great finishing school for any up & coming cricketer & a great pension plan for players who are past their use-by date Internationally, & a great place for seasoned journeymen to earn some reasonable coin before they have to find a real job. To say that a short or even full-season County stint counts as developing a player is laughable. Foreign players securing a stint in County cricket are almost the finished product, they are basically fully developed. With the Kolpak laws, the "...good..." is very much a one way street, & a considerable drain on Saffa resources. England have always had foreign born cricketers in their test team, just atm - it is appears to be at record incidences.

  • POSTED BY RednWhiteArmy on | September 3, 2012, 23:17 GMT

    Yeaaaahhhh! We are the best...

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 3, 2012, 22:02 GMT

    @Cpt.Meanster on (September 02 2012, 21:07 PM GMT) Levi played for Somerset this year in the T20s and TBH , I thought was very 1 dimensional/predictable. Also I'm not too sure if the openers is where there has been a problem as they've always made fair starts.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 3, 2012, 22:02 GMT

    @A_Vacant_Slip on (September 02 2012, 20:30 PM GMT) Hello there , I'm still not convinced with our batting but yes , after the nonsense with Karthik at Somerset it's good to see a great bit of sportsmanship by thee premier bowler. Please publish this time

  • POSTED BY Rajesh_india_1990 on | September 3, 2012, 20:23 GMT

    @jackiethepen ask SWANN to write a book on this pathetic stylish player...for england fans bell is a legend...:))

  • POSTED BY tommytucker on | September 3, 2012, 17:07 GMT

    Posted by Hammond on (September 03 2012, 11:52 AM GMT) @Sachin_the_god_forever- I'm afraid that history will show that Kallis was a better batsman than Sachin, and a better cricketer all round too. Sachin is the best Indian batsman ever, but there are more countries than India that play test cricket.

    hahaa, I enjoyed that one Hammond. here here...

  • POSTED BY jackiethepen on | September 3, 2012, 15:47 GMT

    Bell played a wonderful cover drive in his ODI innings yesterday. It brought a smile of pleasure to his face which he shared with Trotty. Bell is an artist. Yes, it was four more runs, but it wasn't the boundary alone which made him smile. He knew he had just executed a really beautiful stroke. Whether anyone else enjoyed it is a bonus. For those who do appreciate Bell's batting - and we're talking about aesthetics - there will be a difference between his stroke play and the batting of others. If you can't see it, it doesn't matter, literary style isn't that much appreciated these days either but you can still enjoy a book without it. However for those who care Bell is a poet among cricketers.

  • POSTED BY Lloydster on | September 3, 2012, 15:22 GMT

    AB has too much on his plate(wicky and captain) and his batting form has taken a knock as a result. England are a balanced side thats why they are No1, SA too inexperienced to get the balance right with the too many " bits and pieces" in the side.JP, Ryan,Elgar and co. We need batters to put on a reasonable score and bowlers to bowl the Poms out. Period. Simple. SA are choking again under pressure.

  • POSTED BY Long-Leg on | September 3, 2012, 15:06 GMT

    @tommytucker: Oh dear... if you are complaining about "locally developed talent" then take a look at the current South African starting eleven. I count nine of them who have developed their games in English county cricket. South Africa rely on the nursery which is English county cricket, just as much as England rely on South African developed players. Long may this arrangement continue. It is good for both nations.

  • POSTED BY Rajesh_india_1990 on | September 3, 2012, 14:25 GMT

    @hammond nope!! Kallis is an exceptional allsounder..but he is not come in the leagues with batting legends such as sachin,lara,dravid,ponting...for example kallis average in england is very average..whereas sachin average more or less 50 in all parts of the world......ok

  • POSTED BY YorkshirePudding on | September 3, 2012, 13:49 GMT

    @WonkyFNQ, Kieswetters been around the England ODI teams for the last 2-3 years, so its a bit of a suprise to see his birth place cropping up now that England are doing well in ODI cricket...I wonder what the comments are when Indian Expats represent America in an ICC competition, surely they should be banned from playing for anyone BUT india.

  • POSTED BY ashes61 on | September 3, 2012, 13:48 GMT

    Did anyone see Ed Smith's piece on Tredwell in "The Times" this morning? Great to see this player appreciated at last for what he is. He's been in ENG's sights for over a decade & on the edge of the national side for 5 years without getting an extended run, purely because Swann has been such a good attacking spinner. But like Swann, he has been a very consistent county spinner for some years before getting a decent chance and, if required for a consistent spell in the ODI or Test team, will snaffle a lot of wkts for ENG. Excellent in the slips (despite y'day!) and a good bat, easily slotting into, say, No 9 for ENG, with his three 1st class tons & plenty of 50s behind him. Remind you of anyone? And I don't think AB de V is out of form at all. He was playing perfectly OK in his last two ODIs but Tredders outwitted him on both occasions. Don't under estimate this chap!

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 13:46 GMT

    @RandyOZ on (September 03 2012, 13:26 PM GMT), you're quite right. As England fans, we should be well acquainted with easing off in the ODIs after clobbering the opposition in the Test series. After all, the last Ashes weren't all that long ago. You're quite right that SA would have expected a cakewalk too, given England's narrow 4-0 escape against Australia in their previous ODI series.

  • POSTED BY ashes61 on | September 3, 2012, 13:29 GMT

    Why the sudden rash of comments complaining about jmcilhinney's post about Bell? We really should be more careful before sounding off about what we thought or assumed he wrote, but didn't. He didn't say Bell was better than Tendulkar, but the very OPPOSITE - as anyone would. He also acknowledged there are better other batsmen than Bell too. But he appreciates Bell's style and likes watching him more than most others. And so do I. Offhand, I can't remember an ENG batsman more easy on the eye than Bell in the last 50 years, although I expect there were if I thought a bit. Cowdrey or May, perhaps? Yes, of course runs are more important than style (e.g. Collingwood!) but when we teach boys to bat, we try (not always rightly, I know) to encourage an orthodox (or "correct") way of playing a stroke.The result with Bell is as close to that as I can think of. There are other more "natural" or instinctive strokemakers, and far more powerful hitters. But these days Bell is poetry in motion.

  • POSTED BY RandyOZ on | September 3, 2012, 13:26 GMT

    After clobbering England into submission in the test series, its no wonder SA are off to a sluggish start. They expected a cakewalk, but with Swann dropped England have lost their weakest link so they aren't so easy. Still a very average team though so expect SA to come back.

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 13:25 GMT

    @WonkyFNQ on (September 03 2012, 11:52 AM GMT), you're coming a little late to the bandwagon and not really making sense either. Do you think that this is Kieswetter's first series? Kieswetter has played 42 ODIs for England and debuted 2 1/2 years ago. Perhaps if you want to make smart remarks they ought be smart in future.

  • POSTED BY RandyOZ on | September 3, 2012, 13:17 GMT

    I must say I find it hilarious the amount of poms saying they would've won the test series if they held their catches. Apart from the fact that England have always been god awful at fielding, most of the South African batting lineup didn't get a chance in the middle (see 2 wickets in an entire match) and wouldve carved them up anyway. Also funny to see that Swann has been rested. Haha don't kid yourself guys the selectors are sick of his pathetic performances.

  • POSTED BY RandyOZ on | September 3, 2012, 13:12 GMT

    @ Hammond - welcome back. How was your extended summer away from cricket?

  • POSTED BY love_4_the_game on | September 3, 2012, 12:32 GMT

    i feel from 3 odi's SA is not havin a formidable middle order in absence of Kallis and tats causing the matches for them.. i prefer amla shud be in the middle order rather opening the innings. its high time amla moves into the middle order at no 4 . let smith and du plesis open the innings as the latter has done it in IPL matches for CSK. Middle order comprising of Elgar , Amla, ABD, DUminy, Parnell, peterson, steyn, morkel, tsotsobe. in absense of kallis, albie, SA is lookin lil weak

  • POSTED BY arvinth_h on | September 3, 2012, 12:02 GMT

    South Africa's batting line up looks very thin without Kallis.. Not too long before Kallis retires from test cricket as well.!! ABD's innings lacks fire without someone to stabilize the middle order.

  • POSTED BY mthi4life on | September 3, 2012, 12:01 GMT

    The Proteas must stop trying to post big scores and putting pressure on themselves.They must go back to the basics between the middle overs(try to get singles from every ball and and score boundaries from bad ones).But the ODI team is still rebuilding.The English bowlers must also get credit for bowling well and not allowing the Protea's to settle and dictate terms. Congratulations England but I hope the Proteas show us what the are made of in the final game.

  • POSTED BY Hammond on | September 3, 2012, 11:52 GMT

    @Sachin_the_god_forever- I'm afraid that history will show that Kallis was a better batsman than Sachin, and a better cricketer all round too. Sachin is the best Indian batsman ever, but there are more countries than India that play test cricket.

  • POSTED BY WonkyFNQ on | September 3, 2012, 11:52 GMT

    My, my, after getting rid of Pietersen, and then Strauss retiring, England were almost looking, well.... English. But then they picked Kieswetter. Good to see they still have their visa based player development policy.

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 11:47 GMT

    @Rajesh_india_1990, yes I have seen AB de Villiers. Quite recently as it happens. I've seen a lot of other batsmen too. If I was putting a team together, I would pick many of those batsmen ahead of Ian Bell. That doesn't change the fact that, if I had to sit and watch one of them bat all day, I'd rather watch Bell. Whether or not he's a flop in the subcontinent is completely irrelevant to the argument. You can think whomever you like is more stylish than Bell but I say you're wrong. Regardless of who is the better batsman, I stand by my assessment of Bell as being the most stylish current player.

  • POSTED BY premclement on | September 3, 2012, 11:44 GMT

    It makes me laugh when the English fans compare Bell with Tendulkar. Tendulkar is a legend and there is no one who can compete with him from the current English team. Come this Nov, we will see what Eng team is like when they tour India.

  • POSTED BY tommytucker on | September 3, 2012, 11:05 GMT

    Tredwell will get monstered in India. The indian batsmen wont believe their luck when that pie-chucker turns up....Interesting posts on here from English fans claiming their success is down to 'depth of talent'. Hiring cricketers from other countries is hardly a display of locally developed talent...LOL.

  • POSTED BY Sachin_the_god_forever on | September 3, 2012, 10:51 GMT

    @Jmcilhinney@aussiesfalling YES..YES..BELL is better than sachin,lara,ponting.. even better than bradman...SWANN is better than murali,warne,kumble.....ANDERSON is far superior than mcgrath,donald,ambrose etc.....TROTT is the most destructive batsman than sir viv,sehwag,gayle....GILCHRIST was a student of KIESWETTER.....POOR POMMS...:))

  • POSTED BY Guernica on | September 3, 2012, 10:48 GMT

    @jb633 - To be fair I've not really heard any of that bitterness from SA fans. What I have seen has been from some of the more hysterical Indian and Aussie fans who for some reason (jealousy I guess) try to detract whenever possible from England success.

  • POSTED BY bouncedout on | September 3, 2012, 10:46 GMT

    I note that the fairweather Aussies have gone away. RandyOz, Jonesy2 where are youuuuu?

    Are you tired having stayed up late to watch Pakistan humble your boys??

  • POSTED BY Selassie-I on | September 3, 2012, 10:23 GMT

    Good stuff again from the ODI team, they really are turning into a useful outfit. Something England have never been is a decent ODI team, not even half decent! Both teams have a couple fo players out, SA resting Kallis (and Morkel for this match) but Eng without Broad, Swann and KP! showing some real depth and we have Woakes and Bairstow that still can't get in the team. Be nice to see a bit of YJB if Trotty is injured. Nice to see the Aussies out complaining about the SA born players in the team, although Keisy went to Millfield and through the Somerset academy and Derbach through the Surrey academy, i'm afraid these chaps learned their cricket in England guys! I'd be more worried about your own form wih the next world cup in your back yard... if you keep going the way you are then you're goign to struggle in the group stages especially with how well Ireland and Afganestan have been improving!

  • POSTED BY Rajesh_india_1990 on | September 3, 2012, 10:22 GMT

    @jilchinney apart from sachin,have you ever seen AB DE VILLIERS bat..

  • POSTED BY Rajesh_india_1990 on | September 3, 2012, 10:18 GMT

    Lol...bell batting style compared with sachin?...what a stupid stuff?..even rohit sharma batting is more stylish than bell( only batting style)..bell is not in the league to compare with sachin,lara..he is a complete flop player in subcontinent...

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 10:00 GMT

    I'll wade into the Bell/Tendulkar debate. There's no doubt that Tendulkar is a better batsman than Bell. His record speaks for itself. There are few challengers for the best batsman of our generation. There are various other current batsmen who have a better record than Bell too. That said, I have to agree that Bell is quite possibly the most elegant batsman playing the game right now. Obviously everyone is disposed to prefer players from the team that they support but, for me, from a purely aesthetic point of view, Ian Bell is the most pleasing batsman in the world. If I had to sit and watch one person bat all day, there's noone else I'd rather it be. In that time he might be dismissed more often than some others, but that's not the point. There are other batsmen who are pleasing to the eye too, but none more so, as far as I'm concerned.

  • POSTED BY risimati_l on | September 3, 2012, 9:53 GMT

    The proteas batting has been awful the top order has been poor on shot selection except Amla who we now rely on for runs, the middle order has been out of sorts on those slow pitches, they must take responsibility and get stuck in before running down the pitch and underestimating some of the opposition bowling i,e Tredwell and Bopara. its time AB gives us a captains knock on the final ODI, but we rather have this issues now and try to sort them out before a big tournament as we really need to start getting some silverware in our cabinet.

  • POSTED BY jb633 on | September 3, 2012, 9:36 GMT

    Some fans need to learn some modesty. When your side loses you should congratulate the victors and not become bitter. I specifically remember reading that most England fans were happy to acknowledge that SA played some brilliant cricket in the test series. When England win here the excuses are coming in about SA not caring. Seems a bit pathetic to me.

  • POSTED BY Hammond on | September 3, 2012, 9:25 GMT

    Wonder why all the Aussie cricket fans stopped posting here? Maybe because they are about to be beaten by an odi team that England whitewashed only recently?

  • POSTED BY jackiethepen on | September 3, 2012, 9:14 GMT

    I've noticed that appreciation of Bell's batting often comes from Indian fans. Maybe because they have had such great batting to grow up with from the Fab Four. There is no doubt that batting as an art is one of the glories of Indian cricket. I do hope that the IPL will not change that. We've already seen a diminution of batting style in England because of our domestic t20 and, lets face it, the attention paid by the media to the whackers of the ball above finesse. Is style so out of fashion? Or is there a public out there for a different kind of marketing?

  • POSTED BY Aussiesfalling on | September 3, 2012, 8:55 GMT

    @Rajesh_india_1990: In a classical sense, Tendulkar is not in the same class as Ian Bell. When Tendulkar struggles he looks awful, yet even when Bell is struggling, he still looks a million dollars.

  • POSTED BY wimpie on | September 3, 2012, 8:54 GMT

    You cannot compare batsmen just like that. Of course Tendulkar is a great player. But Bell, in his own way, is nice to watch also. And, moreover, he shares the most important quality with Tendulkar : modesty.

  • POSTED BY Gordo85 on | September 3, 2012, 8:53 GMT

    South Africa must really get a win in this last match. I can not understand how things can change so quickly and be playing down hill again. I am very concerned but I think I would drop Lonwabo or Wayne for the last match. Faf needs to be having a bowl since he is not making any runs but maybe he will be dropped for Ontong.

  • POSTED BY suni550 on | September 3, 2012, 8:39 GMT

    the prob is lack of balance in SA team which is caused by the absence of Great man Kallis. SA better find a better replacement b4 kallis retires.

  • POSTED BY Rajesh_india_1990 on | September 3, 2012, 8:27 GMT

    @ajayrcs lol..bell stylish player than sachin?oh my god! really joke of the decade.. have you ever seen sachin bat?it is a treat to the eyes..please dont compare this stupid bell batting style with the living and playing legend sachin..

  • POSTED BY ultimatewarrior on | September 3, 2012, 8:25 GMT

    It's not the AB de Villiers' had lost the form becoz of wicketkeeping responsibilities but its becoz of English Fast bowlers with the help of English pitches are ruling over the batsman's mind and as a result he is going through the bad phase.......I hope de Villiers will be back to form in sub continent or with the mediocre fast bowling....same with duminy...i see england as a new force on atleast pitches helping fast bowlers like SA, Eng, Aus, NZ....

  • POSTED BY Rajesh_india_1990 on | September 3, 2012, 8:25 GMT

    @ajayrcs lol..bell stylish player than sachin?oh my god! really joke of the decade.. have you ever seen sachin bat?it is a treat to the eyes..please dont compare this stupid bell batting style with the living and playing legend sachin..

  • POSTED BY Brenton1 on | September 3, 2012, 7:55 GMT

    I think the problem has been SA losing wickets trying to put up a big score resulting in a sub par score taking all the pressure off the English batsmen. The advantage of batting second is that you know a target and can adjust your game to suit the score. But SA still did bat badly and England did bowl well.

  • POSTED BY ajayrcs on | September 3, 2012, 7:48 GMT

    Bell is a cricketer with best technique. I have never seen a batsman can play like that, so much elegance in his batting. Whichever team he plays and the team lose or win it doesn't matter because watching him bat is worth spending time and money. Even so called great Tendulkar cannot even play like him. Amazing Batsman!

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 3, 2012, 7:37 GMT

    Re AB's form being affected by captaincy/WK duties. I'm not so sure. The stats pre series looked very impressive. Better players than AB have gone through lulls with the bat when they have had no other facets of the game to worry about

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 3, 2012, 7:37 GMT

    @Jonathan Cowley on (September 02 2012, 22:28 PM GMT) They looked as though they cared about this format when it was their turn to be number 1 after the 1st game. Tests are obviously are priority for both sides but Eng are also resting Broad and Swann for this series and I'm not sure if VP has a great record in this format anyway. They rested Steyn for the 1st ODI ahich SA won and then played him twice since. VP was not in the squad I don't think so he was omitted rather than rested.

  • POSTED BY DaRkINvAdoR on | September 3, 2012, 7:31 GMT

    proteas really missed morne in 4th ODI....i watched complete match....i wonder AB is not playing his natural game......hope he will bounce back hard and hit a 100 in last ODI..........go AB go................

  • POSTED BY tommytucker on | September 3, 2012, 7:28 GMT

    Whats is also very evident to me watching these ODIs unfold is that the SA managements main priority was to get that No.1 test ranking spot and getting the ODI series win in eng was a bonus. The ODI team looks very 'put together' and not seen as a crucial series win on the eng tour. The games are not even close or combatively contested like the test series, its seems like the SA team is just going through the motions. I think SA give us a lot more entertainment and competiveness for the T20, since it is a build up fixture to the World Cup T20 coming up soon.

  • POSTED BY tommytucker on | September 3, 2012, 7:21 GMT

    For Saffas ODI cricket is nowhere nearly as important as Test cricket. I think many Eng and SA fans will agree with me, that these ODIs have been an anti-climax to the test series which was riverting. You can see this in the SA team selection and merry-go-round attitude in selection. There are no specialists, just bits and pieces bowlers/batsman. Thats not due to lack of talent, we have plenty of talent in SA, just ask England or NZ. Its just that ODIs dont get the same importance as Tournaments. Im not trying to make excuses here, it its evident to see that SA have looked very flat and disjointed, Eng have played well but not amazingly.

  • POSTED BY on | September 3, 2012, 7:10 GMT

    proteas missed morne in 4th ODI.....i watched match completely....AB is not up to his mark....i wonder why he is not playing his natural game....hope he bats at 1 down in last ODI and hit a hundred...........go AB go...........

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 6:51 GMT

    @amilag on (September 03 2012, 06:15 AM GMT), the main concern about de Villiers was batting after keeping but SA have batted first each game this series, so I'm not sure that that's been a major factor. He also has been batting very well in ODIs up to now, so I'm not sure that his keeping wicket is to blame for a relatively quiet series with the bat. I think that it would be more of a factor in Test matches than ODIs and T20Is.

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 6:31 GMT

    @cover_drive12345 on (September 02 2012, 22:26 PM GMT), it seems to be a well-populated bandwagon where people say that such-and-such a team doesn't deserve to be #1. There is no requirement for any player or team to be dominant to be ranked #1. Just because WI and Australia had periods of greatness and dominance doesn't mean that you have to be that good to be able to claim the #1 ranking. Any team who can attain that ranking must have been playing relatively well for a period of time. Noone is playing well enough at the moment to stay at #1 in any format for any great length of time so expect the #1 rankings to change hands several more times over the next few years or even months for the limited-overs formats. The fact that they don't stay there for years does not mean that a team didn't deserve the #1 ranking while they hold it though. Saying that someone doesn't deserve it implies that someone else does, but who else is playing consistently better?

  • POSTED BY amilag on | September 3, 2012, 6:15 GMT

    The day Boucher retired, SA lost their best batsman AB! This has created a big vacuum in SA batting and it seems to me that AB can't concentrate batting after keeping. He was in superb form among the best batsman in the world before this series.

  • POSTED BY Chris_P on | September 3, 2012, 6:15 GMT

    @__PK. Is it so hard to to acknowledge a side for their performance? They have bounced back well after the first game, where many posted of their impending slide. I got no issues with giving credit where it's due.

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 6:12 GMT

    @zarasochozarasamjho on (September 02 2012, 18:41 PM GMT), to say that the result of this game depended largely on winning the toss would be a gross exaggeration. Cook put SA in because the initial conditions looked better for bowling but it's not like England batted in blazing sunshine. The conditions were fairly consistent throughout the game, so I don't think that the toss had much impact at all.

  • POSTED BY Hira1 on | September 3, 2012, 6:11 GMT

    Its getting too much for AB...captain, keeper and batsman, he should quit either captaincy or keeping. AB is a very fine batsman and in this series he didn't perform at all, such a boring series when KP not in and AB not performing at its potential.

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 6:10 GMT

    @MartinC on (September 02 2012, 18:06 PM GMT), it could have something to do with Tsotsobe being ranked #2 (until recently #1) ODI bowler in the world.

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 6:08 GMT

    @Mel_Vin on (September 02 2012, 18:05 PM GMT), had England run Amla out on 1 or caught him on 42 in the first game then they'd be up 3-0 and noone would be thinking about KP.

  • POSTED BY on | September 3, 2012, 6:01 GMT

    Well done to England. Us saffas were 'kings for a day' - that seems like ages ago now. The England strategy has been effective and I don't know if the Proteas will be able to adapt before the final game. They tried to play the same game as England and it did not come off, mostly I think because the middle order has not been as strong / as disciplined as England's. Regarding the pitches - it would be boring if all pitches were the same and designed for batting. Great teams should be able to win on any pitch and in any condition. The Protea's have usually had problems on slow pitches and if there is a similar pitch in the next game, I would think England will take the tournament.

  • POSTED BY Harshu88 on | September 3, 2012, 5:31 GMT

    i thnk Eng nt missing KP here...bt they will definitely miss him in World T20...as he is in commentator section..

  • POSTED BY KunzMan on | September 3, 2012, 5:19 GMT

    Looks really difficult to square the series now. Especially with Trott injured, Bairstow likely to comein. (Blessing in disguise for England)? SA should field the following XI in this batting order for Trentbridge and hope to square it. 1) Smith 2) Elgar 3) Amla 4) AB 5) JP 6) du Plessis 7) Albie Morkel 8) Robin Peterson 9) Wayne Parnell 10) Dale Steyn 11) Morne Morkel

  • POSTED BY KunzMan on | September 3, 2012, 5:15 GMT

    Personally, I am glad that SA rested Kllis to prolong his career. It has exposed the fickle nature of selection of SA management in ODIs atleast. Finding his equivalent is going to be hard is an understatement. But then fact remains that he at most has 2 maybe 3 years and that too being played selectively? What after that? Bits and pieces cricketers like McLaren, Elgar, Peterson etc are no good. Is it too hard for the horses to realise that it was the specialists who won the test series and not these average / below average "all rounders"?

  • POSTED BY KunzMan on | September 3, 2012, 5:11 GMT

    Well played England. I thought 220 might be a bit more tricky to chase than what it suggested. However, Bell, Morgan and Kieswetter played without any problem.

  • POSTED BY satish619chandar on | September 3, 2012, 3:19 GMT

    England again coming off quite well.. WQuite impressed with the bowling of Tredwell and Bopara. Quicks not allowing the batsmen to get starts and the stranglers doing the job in the middle overs. Once they get opponents for below 250 score, they are the favorites as they have enough guys to do the job. England might struggle to score above 270 but with bowling which can limit the score within their limits, they can certainly hold to No.1 slot a bit longer in shorter format. Probably, SA are leaving too much to the middle order that sans Kallis - though that will be the future for them. Too slow to start and ABD not playing big innings in recent times are affecting them. May be, ABD is not able to cope up with triple role? Adding one more spinner would make things a bit tougher for England. Felt they are playing too many allrounders without playing the best of them in Albie.

  • POSTED BY __PK on | September 3, 2012, 2:16 GMT

    South Africa are suffering from a let-down after dominating the test series. No other reason for England winning.

  • POSTED BY Hammond on | September 3, 2012, 2:02 GMT

    Great game, England looked pretty dominant and they finally stopped bowling at Smith's pads, made him look slow and crab like. Very satisfying viewing even if I did have to stay up til 3am to watch it!

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 1:58 GMT

    When this tour is over I think most SA watchers will look back and say that de Villiers batting has been a bit disappointing. If England had held their catches then they'd be saying the same thing about Amla. If England had held their catches then they may well have drawn or even won the Test series and would likely be 3-0 up here too. The fact is that they didn't hold their catches though, and their batting and bowling was not good enough to make up for that, so SA deserve their success. This all tells me two things though: this SA team are far from unbeatable and England can stay at or near the top if they can just start fielding like an international cricket team. SA cannot rely on every team gifting them lives the way England did this summer. Some SA fans seem to think that they're a shoe in against Australia but I don't think so. Australia are not the great team they were but they're better than the team that lost the last Ashes.

  • POSTED BY jmcilhinney on | September 3, 2012, 1:43 GMT

    @Jonathan Cowley on (September 02 2012, 22:28 PM GMT), I'm not sure I agree with you completely there. No doubt SA are prioritising Test cricket, as they should, but I'm not sure that it's correct to say that they don't care about ODIs outside of WCs. If they actually do care about WCs then it wasn't evident from the last one. If SA want to do well at the next WC then they won't want to leave their preparation too late. Common sense would suggest that aiming for a good performance in next year's Champion's Trophy would be a good idea too. There's no doubt that Kallis' absence has had a big effect on this team but I wonder whether they have rested him specifically to see how the team performs without him, as they will have to do in the not-too-distant future and likely in the 2015 WC. The answer is not too well so far. As for Philander, to say that they're resting him when he's not a regular member of the ODI squad is a bit disingenuous.

  • POSTED BY vertical on | September 3, 2012, 1:06 GMT

    I don't think saffers should be too bothered with this result.They have been experimenting and trying out new players,building up a team for the world cup.In spite of all their achievements they have flattered to deceive in big tournaments and that should be the goal of the current set up.The longer their bare trophy cabinet gets the more they will be under pressure in each world cup tournament.The next world cup in Australia is the perfect opportunity the pitches suit SA's style of play if only they could get a strong top and middle order and not bits and pieces cricketers.

  • POSTED BY Sinhaya on | September 3, 2012, 0:58 GMT

    Well done England and glad you all won! At least now sure that the ODI series is not lost. Bell should even try opening in test matches.

  • POSTED BY Patchmaster on | September 3, 2012, 0:56 GMT

    Bopara has run his course, time for someone else. Bairstow has to come in now for Bopara. Morgan and Bairstow are the perfect foil for Cook and Trott. Bopara has proven that he simply can't finish a game, plus he's a very average fielder, as opposed to Bairstow who is outstanding.

  • POSTED BY phoenixsteve on | September 3, 2012, 0:33 GMT

    Having read through the commets at length I'm compelled to add my 6 eggs worth? Don't agree that the pitches should be doctored to be more batting friendly - we might be in danger of T20/IPL instant gratification if we're not careful. Kieswetter didn't seem to have any pitch difficulties as he smashed Steyn for six to win the game? This series (and the tests) has been played with great spirit and sportsmanship on show - even a little 'slapstick' humour? I noticed that no-one was in a hurry to rub Morkels 'injury' at the Oval but there were laughs aplenty! Steyn proved his gentlemanly professionalism as he admired the final stoke today - good for him and great for the game! A few SA fans have hinted that SA are not trying and that these ODIs don't really count for much? Strange as the number one ODI side title was at stake? Sour grapes I suspect - almost worthy of an Aussie...... COME ON ENGLAND!!!

  • POSTED BY on | September 3, 2012, 0:31 GMT

    There's a very different mind-set betwen GETTING to the top (of the rankings) and STAYING at the top, as the Indians and Poms well know. Saffas beware!

  • POSTED BY BG4cricket on | September 3, 2012, 0:23 GMT

    ashes61 - agree with your point on Bell with regards to ODI where he has been excellent however his record in 11 tests this year is poor for a player of his quality - 500 runs at an ave of around 30 is not great. Coupled with a very poor series against Pakistan's spinners I wouldn't be too confident of automatic success in India who while poor away will be tough to toss at home where Ashwin and Ojha are significantly better bowlers than they will look anywhere else.

  • POSTED BY maddy20 on | September 3, 2012, 0:18 GMT

    It looks like half of the England's dressing room is filled with U-19 or national players from other countries. Trott, Morgan, Kieswetter. Seriusly, is it so hard to make a XI with your own players? Bairstow was good enough to earn a call-up. These antics of ECB are only gonna make the world downplay their wins whether they are gonna win or lose. Ofcourse this world XI is not gonna save them in India, but I am just saying.

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 23:55 GMT

    Very happy to see that 2 English boys, Bell & Tredwell lead the chase to victory. Good show. Good for "English" cricket.

  • POSTED BY phoenixsteve on | September 2, 2012, 23:32 GMT

    Another England win & an even better performance than at the Oval. The catching reamins a worry though but the bowling was good & Bell showed us what he's capable of with a great/classy knock. SA are looking a little flat -maybe they are suffering from motivation issues rather like England after they trounced the Aussies in the recent Ashes series? England are playing to around 85% capabilty whereas SA have dropped to 75%. The potential difference between the sides is still very cloose but the home advantage is starting to tell. I agree that SA are missing Kallis and also missing Philander who for me was the bowling star of the test series. If Trott's trotter is injured & he can't play on Wednesday it'll be nice to see Bairstow on duty. Bopara is overperforming with the ball (ask Amla?) & underperforming with the bat. It's going to be a selection conundrum but I imagine he's been promised a complete ODI series. The new muted 'handshake' celebrations are perfect too! COME ON ENGLAND!!!

  • POSTED BY Coolbawn on | September 2, 2012, 22:56 GMT

    Ravi has only had two low scores since a good run against WI and Australia. Morgan seems to rate him highly - and he's a rival of sorts.

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 22:28 GMT

    Let's all face it - SA don't care much about the ODI's outside of world cups. If they did they wouldn't rest their best batsman (Kallis) or most promising in form bowler (Philander). Kirsten is clever and he knows that Test results are the ones remembered. Until the world cup comes along, only then will the emphasis change.

  • POSTED BY cover_drive12345 on | September 2, 2012, 22:26 GMT

    Do want to see AB come in earlier in the game and not give his wicket away after playing himself in. However with this current crop of teams, I don't really think any of them deserve to be number one. england win again, but not convincingly and South Africa make basic mistakes that cost them the match. However today Bell played really well, showing the Priteas how it's done. It was an important toss to win for England but that again is not excuse from South Africa. Haven't seen them chasing on this tour, maybe that might help.

  • POSTED BY BG4cricket on | September 2, 2012, 22:20 GMT

    I think we are really seeing the impact Kallis has on this team as they look both a batsman and bowler short at the moment and Elgar looks a touch limited as a stroke player at this level based on his 3 innings - perhaps he bats 3 with the message to be a sheet anchor ? Perhaps bring Ontong in at 6 instead of McLaren and rely on Duminy, du Plessis and Elgar to bowl 10 overs and have Philander in for Tsotsobe who has lost a fair bit of form might give a little better balance.

  • POSTED BY ashes61 on | September 2, 2012, 22:20 GMT

    Agree with others. Bell is not only ENG's best batsman (although Cook's record is excellent & he had a great 2010 & 2011) but he is also by far the most attractive bat we've had in years. Just beautiful to watch. A pretty heavy scorer these days in Tests & ODIs and should do well in India again. We have all taken him for granted for a year or two as he has finally come into his own since 2009 or so, and will score heaps of runs. Very fit, & a good fielder. ENG's best player?

  • POSTED BY torsha on | September 2, 2012, 22:16 GMT

    Wow SA is getting hammered. Not sure which is the best ODIs team as of now because England rank is not proper in any means. Amla is good but not the best because he is playing some of the risky shots and could have been out many times.

  • POSTED BY ashes61 on | September 2, 2012, 22:15 GMT

    landl47 - That's where "Tredders" fields almost alll the time for Kent, & an excellent slipper he is too. I was shocked when he dropped one as he is normally so reliable. I'd already seen him as ENG's answer to their current dropping problem. Still, I suppose he's allowed one - but he should certainly stay in the slips. Great to see him in for a decent run, too. There probably isn't a better spinner in England at the moment, unless it's Monty and of course Swann when fit, notwithstanding the one or two good county young 'uns coming through. He'll certainly be in the Test squad for India - Tredders, Swann & Monty I suppose, with at least 2 always picked. Patel as a backup, but he's not in the same league as Tredwell - who, incidentally, can bat too! No-one should be fooled by his undemonstrative appearance or demeanour. Stumped Prior (or K'wetter) b Tredwell" could soon be as common as "stumped Jones b Tredwell" is in Kent - and that's VERY common, abeit mostly in Div 2. He is 30.

  • POSTED BY BokkeForever on | September 2, 2012, 21:58 GMT

    As a worried Saffa - is this what life after Kallis is going to be like?

  • POSTED BY ZiggyMarley on | September 2, 2012, 21:51 GMT

    South Africa's batting have relied heavily on Amla, Smith, AB and Kallis for the last 4 years at least in boths Tests and ODIs. There have been intermittent contributions from Duminy (in ODIs mainly) and Alviro Petersen (in tests mostly), but outside of that, very few innings of substance. Jacques Rudolph, Faf du Plessis, Colin Ingram, David Miller, Morne van Wyk, Dean Elgar have all been shown to be well sub-par for a world number 1 side. Meanwhile, the likes of Ryan McLaren, Wayne Parnell and Albie Morkel have been well below standard too. Peterson and Botha have been okay as spinners and lower order batsmen. Only two of Morkel, Tsotsobe and Steyn should be selected and Vernon Philander needs to get a look-in given his superior batting ability.

  • POSTED BY jb633 on | September 2, 2012, 21:41 GMT

    I am happy that England won today but I am worried about the state of ODI cricket. I think pitches in test matches should always give some assistance to the bowers, but in ODI cricket the favour should always be with the batsmen. With the weather around in England atm I can understand why the pitches are seaming a little but since the introduction of two new balls the games are becoming lower scoring. ODI cricket should aim to entertain and people want to see sixes and fours. I am not really sure that seaming tracks and two new balls is the way the ICC is going to save this format.

  • POSTED BY Cpt.Meanster on | September 2, 2012, 21:07 GMT

    As much as their test team looks formidable, I feel SA's 50 overs team is slightly weak. They haven't got their combinations right. Why is JP Duminy batting at 3 ? I cannot understand this. He's more of a finisher. Also, SA need an attacking spinning option. Peterson doesn't cut it IMO. Also how about giving Richard Levi a game ? He might be weak in slow and low conditions BUT he can still hit the ball well. Sometimes an aggressive opener is required to give the team the kind of start that could instil confidence among the ranks. I also feel Faf Du Plessis is wasted below the order. He opened so well for the Chennai Super Kings in the IPL. So as we can see, SA are doing a lot of things wrong with their team. Hopefully they can correct these before the next game or else it's a series loss.

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 21:02 GMT

    I just cant watch Odi's anymore -_-

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 20:39 GMT

    SA are really a batsmen short in the absence of Kallis, dont know what they will when he will retire SA are neglecting the batsmen who played well in past and have talent and trying tactics which are making them a batsmen short and filling all rounders who are not a worthy batsmen like mclaren, parnel Call Philander for one days, so that their Bowling get stronger in the absence of kallis. Call back Colin Ingram and david Miller, youngster with talent. It will build a strong team for future

    Team: 1) Smith 2) Amla 3) Colin Ingram 4) AB DeVilliers 5) Dean Elgar 6) David Miller/Du Plessis 7) JP Duminy 8) Robin Peterson 9) Vernon Philander 10) Morne Morkel 11 Dale Steyn

    Bowling options: Steyn, Morkel, Philander, Peterson, (Duminy, Elgar, Du Plessis) Can share 10 overs Batting: Strong Opening Smith and Amla Good Middle Orders : Ingram, AB, Elgar (AB can change the game) Duminy and Du Plusses can speed up things Peterson can play a cameo

    8 batsmen and 7 bowling option

    Suggestion if any?

  • POSTED BY A_Vacant_Slip on | September 2, 2012, 20:30 GMT

    @JG2704 - Hello. I tried to reply to you on the other thread but they didn't publish. Good game today which really prove England have excellent depth in the ODI squad. England beat a decent South Africa team WITHOUT the service of KP, Broad and Swann. And still good player like Woakes and Bairstow cannot get a game. This game wasn't close. Great England bowling - especially the spin bowling as this pitch take much spin. Thrilling to see Kieswetter smash Steyn back over his head for a six to win the game. My God! What a shot! And did you see Steyn applaud it? That is true sportsmanship. Steyn is a brilliant cricketer. He was almost unplayable today. What a bowler... I love to watch him.

  • POSTED BY jackthelad on | September 2, 2012, 20:30 GMT

    Amla is a good, but not a great, batsman. He's been given life after life, and still you'd back yourself to get him out

  • POSTED BY landl47 on | September 2, 2012, 20:14 GMT

    Finn hardly gets a mention in this report, but he bowled brilliantly. He was too good for both SA's openers but the catches went down, he was deprived of another wicket when the umpire failed to detect a plumb LBW and he still had the excellent figures of 10-0-33-1, with hardly a run coming off the middle of the bat. Bopara bowled very well, but he should be coming in at 7, behind Morgan, Kieswetter and Patel. Bell proved yet again that he is a top player and doesn't just make runs against the weak Australian and Indian attacks. Tredwell bowled beautifully, but why is he fielding in the slips? Still, another win for England, which ensures SA won't go home with all three #1 rankings. If only the fielding had been better, they might not have gone home with the test ranking either- Amla must think this Summer is a charity set up specially for him. There's work needed if the excellent performances by the bowlers are not to be wasted.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 2, 2012, 20:10 GMT

    Still not convinced by our formation but I reckon - esp with his injury - Jonny will replace Trott for the final game. I think it's lucky for Ravi that he bowls some decent overs because surely we have better batting options , even discounting KP and Jonny. Tredwell certainly bowled well and seems to be a reliable bowler when called upon. I suppose we stay number 1 in ODIs til we play India but it seems kind of hollow after losing the test number 1 so tamely.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 2, 2012, 20:00 GMT

    @jackiethepen on (September 02 2012, 18:49 PM GMT) Let it go. It's all very subjective. The bowlers bowled well again and restricted SA to 220 and Bell and Trott put on a great partnership. Surely it's not that important who gets the most words written about them. Remember what happened the other day when the bowlers didn't restrict SA batsmen?

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 2, 2012, 19:54 GMT

    @zarasochozarasamjho on (September 02 2012, 18:41 PM GMT) when the side who loses the toss bats better

  • POSTED BY cool2cool on | September 2, 2012, 19:53 GMT

    Any chance an India player playing for "United 11"? There so many talented Indian players not getting chance to play for India.

  • POSTED BY JG2704 on | September 2, 2012, 19:52 GMT

    @MartinC on (September 02 2012, 18:06 PM GMT) Maybe because he was up until recently rated the best ODI bowler in the world. Not sure where he is now rated

  • POSTED BY cool2cool on | September 2, 2012, 19:51 GMT

    @dabhand : India and Pak are going head to head for a 3-ODI series in India in Decmeber, so England may not be #1 until next year.

  • POSTED BY allblue on | September 2, 2012, 19:50 GMT

    @Greatest_Game I like your thinking - perhaps England have been trying a similarly cunning strategy by constantly dropping Amla, hoping to subliminally persuade the SA selectors to do the same!

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 19:39 GMT

    i think englnd and indian are lion of home and come to srilanka i predict some big batsman like bell morgan hales keiwetar baistow luke right to watch they can defend the title of champion after this home series t20 three match series

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 19:33 GMT

    @sachin. Did you notice you were on a very large cricket website with a great database?

  • POSTED BY cheguramana on | September 2, 2012, 19:30 GMT

    Here we go again! SA do the hard part of the job, beating the No.1 Test team in the world and grabbing that title. And then they lose focus and lose the ODI series. Makes you wonder - do they have what it takes, to repeat Australia's feat, of dominating both Test and ODI rankings for years at a stretch ?

  • POSTED BY dabhand on | September 2, 2012, 19:10 GMT

    Well that's England back to #1 until next year.Not quite the 5-0 SA win certain individuals were suggesting. And without KP - so those individuals who suggested England couldn't win without him seem to be equally wrong in their opinions.

    Sorta gives you some idea of the value of their other opinions ! Perhaps they'll admit they were wrong and even understand that a team is more than an individual - but of course, silly me, that'll only happen when pigs fly !

  • POSTED BY allblue on | September 2, 2012, 19:08 GMT

    @SurlyCynic I agree with you that for ODIs and T20 you want good (i.e. good for batting) pitches, but you have to bear in mind this has been the wettest summer on record in England. Not only has it lost us a lot of cricket, but the pitches have spent so long under the covers, with little decent sun when it stopped raining, that it has been impossible to produce hard, true surfaces. Things were made even more difficult at Lords where the Olympics 'posh man's darts' (archery) event was staged, meaning the whole square was under cover for the duration. It's been a tough year for English groundsmen.

  • POSTED BY cool2cool on | September 2, 2012, 18:56 GMT

    I was wondering why there are not that many 19-20 aged players playing for "United 11". Then I got the answer, the imports need to stay there for at least 4 years or so to qualify to play for "United 11" and by the time they do, they are already 23-24.

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 18:55 GMT

    England are standing up and been counted . Ian Bell and Kieswetter , Morgan are all showing that they can do it.

    Tredwell just show's what I always said Swann is over rated as a spinner and clowns on too much off pitch.

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 18:52 GMT

    Where's the SA team of old where we batted down to number 8,now it seems if smith,amla and de villiers don't score we can't make any runs.

  • POSTED BY cool2cool on | September 2, 2012, 18:52 GMT

    Did "United 11" play better in the last 2 matches or is the "C" word coming back to hurt SA?

  • POSTED BY jackiethepen on | September 2, 2012, 18:49 GMT

    This report seems very Tredwell slanted. I think he is mentioned in 7 paragraphs while Man of the Match Bell gets two sentences. David Hopps has often told us that Bell hasn't got a popular following on Cricinfo. Given that his outstanding knock of 88 gets this treatment are we surprised? Bell and Trott put together a partnership of 141 after England were 2-1. That is some response and Steyn was at his most fiery. It wasn't easy batting either as the low score cards show, Bell got twice the runs of his nearest rival, Amla, who is pretty handy with the bat. Amla should have been out on 4 - dropped by Tredwell. It was a good game and Tredwell had a mixed match, good bowling, terrible fielding. Bopara also, good bowling, terrible batting. But a victory for England and Bell played the leading role.

  • POSTED BY suniljoseph on | September 2, 2012, 18:45 GMT

    This is once again a superb professional performance by England. And I am unsure about South Africa whether they have enough back up players or not. You see once Kallis is out of their set up, how badly they can perform. And these are ODI's and once the time is out for Kallis and Smith in tests also, what will happen to this so called great team. Whereas KP is not playing for them, still they are winning. So this is an example of enough back up players for England. Come on England Lions and conquer the world once again, this time through bat and ball.

  • POSTED BY zarasochozarasamjho on | September 2, 2012, 18:41 GMT

    When shall we have winning a ODI not largely resting on winning the toss. This belittles cricket.

  • POSTED BY Sachin_the_god_forever on | September 2, 2012, 18:27 GMT

    @jose puliampatta Lol...ya i agree he is good and better than autobiographer swann at the moment...:))

  • POSTED BY RakeshJainB on | September 2, 2012, 18:23 GMT

    Bell rings again. England goes 2-1 up and the series is wide open . If its gonna be 2-2 , then who will be # 1 .

  • POSTED BY prannsshu on | September 2, 2012, 18:19 GMT

    Tradwell should be in english team, along with bopara against the india test series in Nov. Both with ball can make the difference, bopara can play indian spinner well jst c0z of his indian blood, nd too play spin well is in blood of every Indian.

  • POSTED BY MartinC on | September 2, 2012, 18:14 GMT

    @RandyOz - I realise you are trolling and have no interest in this response but for the benefit of anyone interested in being objective Dernbach moved to England with his family when he was 14, is a British Citizen and played ALL his cricket including schools cricket in England. England winning games just kills some posters on here.

  • POSTED BY prannsshu on | September 2, 2012, 18:11 GMT

    Oh Ravi.. What r u doing with the bat? M a vry vry vry vry big fan of bopara bt this is s0mething n0t g00d, he's l00king so so focus with ball, nd vry unfocus with the bat. C'm0n Ravi u r future of English cricket c'm0n... By the way c0ngo Poms u deserves to be n0. 1 cheers.

  • POSTED BY MartinC on | September 2, 2012, 18:06 GMT

    Can someone from SA explain to me how Tsotsobe gets in their side ahead of Morkel or Philander (who is not even in the squad). Playing players who bat a bit and bowl a bit is also not the way to go - England tried that back in the 90's with not much success.

  • POSTED BY Natesan333 on | September 2, 2012, 18:06 GMT

    News flash: England declares odis to be the purest form of cricket, tests are now meaningless!!

  • POSTED BY Ra_Thore on | September 2, 2012, 18:05 GMT

    If the South African KP was in this series, Eng would have been 3-0 at this stage.

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 18:03 GMT

    Wots the song name which played oftr the match in short highlights????

  • POSTED BY Sachin_the_god_forever on | September 2, 2012, 17:27 GMT

    @jose puliampatta lol...i agree he is good and better than autobiographer swann at the moment..:))

  • POSTED BY on | September 2, 2012, 16:07 GMT

    @Sachin_the_God_forever. Tredwell is not "39 and going on 40", if that is the answer you were looking for! Definitely younger than Swann. Don't be fooled by the crown. And, he is good.

  • POSTED BY kc69 on | September 2, 2012, 15:35 GMT

    Don't worry England will win(If you get Amla and Ab wickets).England has very good chances of winning.

  • POSTED BY RednWhiteArmy on | September 2, 2012, 13:51 GMT

    RandyOz we've all heard you copy+paste your welcome back to the England fans in every comment you've posted in the last 2 weeks...it's becoming slightly sad & pathetic...

  • POSTED BY Sachin_the_god_forever on | September 2, 2012, 13:40 GMT

    Friends..please tell me what is the age of TREDWELL?

  • POSTED BY Akshita29 on | September 2, 2012, 13:34 GMT

    Now swan should pack his bags from odi cricket . And for SA they need some strokemakers . And smith should cut down on that down the track and half pull half slog stroke.

  • POSTED BY SurlyCynic on | September 2, 2012, 13:24 GMT

    I've been disappointed with the pitches this series. Sometimes low scoring games are the best, but when the ball doesn't come onto the bat properly it makes for scratchy innings, like we saw by both teams in the last test. Even if the pitch offers seam and conditions favour swing the bounce should still be true. Once again SA are a batsman light - wouldn't Miller coming in in place of McLaren have been an improvement? Wouldn't there still have been enough bowling, looking at the spinners and part timers succeeding for England?

  • POSTED BY RandyOZ on | September 2, 2012, 13:16 GMT

    If England do get up here, I'd like to issue a pre-emptive welcome back to all the poms that have been missing the last month or two. @rednwhitearmy, @hammond, @frontfootlunge welcome back lads!

  • POSTED BY RandyOZ on | September 2, 2012, 13:09 GMT

    Wow, Meaker out, Dernbach in and guess where he is from? No prizes, another South African. Do England not have any shame? Also, poor form by the reporter creating excuses once again.

  • POSTED BY KunzMan on | September 2, 2012, 13:02 GMT

    England to win this by feasting on Tsotsobe and McLaren. C'mon Lopsy! Make me eat my words

  • POSTED BY Greatest_Game on | September 2, 2012, 12:51 GMT

    Ah well. SA are a batsman short & overloaded with bowlers again. Dropping Morne Morkel was the SA selectors chance to shoot themselves in the other foot. Load the team with bowlers and leave out the best? Fine thinking there! McLaren is NOT a positive move to add batting strength. He'd have to score runs to do that! Parnell, working hard to squash rumors that he can bat, Duminy & De Villiers decided that the trick to keep Bairstow out is to make Kieswetter look good, & now he is looking great! Faf Du Plessis, by finding ever new ways to be bowled for 1 by Bopara, thus ensures that Woakes is kept out. These are cunning tactics, but not very efficient nearing the end of the series. I just hope that Tsotsobe has dropped his scheme to bowl wildly and concede runs faster than KP can tweet in order to confuse the Eng batsmen. The are confused already by their own selectors, just like SA are. SA's only hope is that Eng are "Petersened." They are very very susceptible to a Petersening!

  • POSTED BY R_U_4_REAL_NICK on | September 2, 2012, 12:35 GMT

    Told you Tredwell should be kept in the team. Patel is useful, but he's not a key frontline spinner. Either Swann or Tredwell should be in all tests/ODI's IMO, unless pitches/conditions necessitate seamers/pace only. I'm beginning to think perhaps England should bring all 3: Swann, Tredwell and Patel, to upcoming India series...

  • POSTED BY R_U_4_REAL_NICK on | September 2, 2012, 11:39 GMT

    Jade Dernbach has played no less than 16 ODI matches for England now. Why are pomme-bashers going on and on about the number of SA-decent players in the England team, as if Dernbach was completely new to the team? Run out of original things to moan about? No surprises at all with the team selections... If England win again today, I foresee them being boring and sticking with the same team for quite some time now, barring injuries or more Twitter/KP-like sagas!

  • POSTED BY Mervo on | September 2, 2012, 10:54 GMT

    Another South African! There must be none left there now. They have all moved to England. It's a fast track to the England team.

  • POSTED BY Beazle on | September 2, 2012, 10:30 GMT

    Greg Chappell may not have been much of a coach or man manager but he was a really tremendous batsman. His average of 53.86 is the highest of all his peers in that era but when you consider he was the leading batsman in WSC ( yes, above both Richards) when he scorded 1546 supertest runs at 58 with six centuries - it is an absolute joke that those runs are not counted in his career !

    To give only one example- Compare his 246 not out in 1978 against Roberts, Holding, Imran and Underwood with "whoever" in , say 2004, bullying poor hapless Zmbabwe or Bangladesh for another meaningless hundred in something laughably called a "Test".

    Which is the greater ?

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  • POSTED BY Beazle on | September 2, 2012, 10:30 GMT

    Greg Chappell may not have been much of a coach or man manager but he was a really tremendous batsman. His average of 53.86 is the highest of all his peers in that era but when you consider he was the leading batsman in WSC ( yes, above both Richards) when he scorded 1546 supertest runs at 58 with six centuries - it is an absolute joke that those runs are not counted in his career !

    To give only one example- Compare his 246 not out in 1978 against Roberts, Holding, Imran and Underwood with "whoever" in , say 2004, bullying poor hapless Zmbabwe or Bangladesh for another meaningless hundred in something laughably called a "Test".

    Which is the greater ?

  • POSTED BY Mervo on | September 2, 2012, 10:54 GMT

    Another South African! There must be none left there now. They have all moved to England. It's a fast track to the England team.

  • POSTED BY R_U_4_REAL_NICK on | September 2, 2012, 11:39 GMT

    Jade Dernbach has played no less than 16 ODI matches for England now. Why are pomme-bashers going on and on about the number of SA-decent players in the England team, as if Dernbach was completely new to the team? Run out of original things to moan about? No surprises at all with the team selections... If England win again today, I foresee them being boring and sticking with the same team for quite some time now, barring injuries or more Twitter/KP-like sagas!

  • POSTED BY R_U_4_REAL_NICK on | September 2, 2012, 12:35 GMT

    Told you Tredwell should be kept in the team. Patel is useful, but he's not a key frontline spinner. Either Swann or Tredwell should be in all tests/ODI's IMO, unless pitches/conditions necessitate seamers/pace only. I'm beginning to think perhaps England should bring all 3: Swann, Tredwell and Patel, to upcoming India series...

  • POSTED BY Greatest_Game on | September 2, 2012, 12:51 GMT

    Ah well. SA are a batsman short & overloaded with bowlers again. Dropping Morne Morkel was the SA selectors chance to shoot themselves in the other foot. Load the team with bowlers and leave out the best? Fine thinking there! McLaren is NOT a positive move to add batting strength. He'd have to score runs to do that! Parnell, working hard to squash rumors that he can bat, Duminy & De Villiers decided that the trick to keep Bairstow out is to make Kieswetter look good, & now he is looking great! Faf Du Plessis, by finding ever new ways to be bowled for 1 by Bopara, thus ensures that Woakes is kept out. These are cunning tactics, but not very efficient nearing the end of the series. I just hope that Tsotsobe has dropped his scheme to bowl wildly and concede runs faster than KP can tweet in order to confuse the Eng batsmen. The are confused already by their own selectors, just like SA are. SA's only hope is that Eng are "Petersened." They are very very susceptible to a Petersening!

  • POSTED BY KunzMan on | September 2, 2012, 13:02 GMT

    England to win this by feasting on Tsotsobe and McLaren. C'mon Lopsy! Make me eat my words

  • POSTED BY RandyOZ on | September 2, 2012, 13:09 GMT

    Wow, Meaker out, Dernbach in and guess where he is from? No prizes, another South African. Do England not have any shame? Also, poor form by the reporter creating excuses once again.

  • POSTED BY RandyOZ on | September 2, 2012, 13:16 GMT

    If England do get up here, I'd like to issue a pre-emptive welcome back to all the poms that have been missing the last month or two. @rednwhitearmy, @hammond, @frontfootlunge welcome back lads!

  • POSTED BY SurlyCynic on | September 2, 2012, 13:24 GMT

    I've been disappointed with the pitches this series. Sometimes low scoring games are the best, but when the ball doesn't come onto the bat properly it makes for scratchy innings, like we saw by both teams in the last test. Even if the pitch offers seam and conditions favour swing the bounce should still be true. Once again SA are a batsman light - wouldn't Miller coming in in place of McLaren have been an improvement? Wouldn't there still have been enough bowling, looking at the spinners and part timers succeeding for England?

  • POSTED BY Akshita29 on | September 2, 2012, 13:34 GMT

    Now swan should pack his bags from odi cricket . And for SA they need some strokemakers . And smith should cut down on that down the track and half pull half slog stroke.