New Zealand in India 2012

'New Zealand are going to struggle in India'

ESPNcricinfo staff

August 20, 2012

Comments: 45 | Text size: A | A

Ross Taylor drives through the off side, West Indies v New Zealand, 2nd Test, Jamaica, 1st day, August 2, 2012
Ross Taylor's side awaits a tough challenge © DigicelCricket.com/Brooks LaTouche Photography
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New Zealand are in for a tough time in India in the Test series due to questions over their ability to take 20 wickets in a Test, the lack of world-class players, and some poor form coming in to the tour, according to former opener Mark Richardson and former fast bowler Simon Doull.

Richardson and Doull, in conversation with Harsha Bhogle on ESPNcricinfo's audio show Time Out, said the changes in structure, the appointment of a new coach and inconsistency from some of the team's senior players added to New Zealand's problems.

"I think New Zealand are going to struggle," Richardson said. "There's no form behind them, they're going to a very difficult place to succeed. The motivation will be there but I believe they are down on confidence.

"I just can't see this New Zealand team bowling out India. So draws, and one or two times that [Brendon] McCullum and [Ross] Taylor might come off may give them a chance in the shorter games."

New Zealand were beaten 0-2 in the Tests against West Indies before this tour, and they will be without Daniel Vettori, their lead spinner, due to injury. They have five seamers in the squad and two spinners, Tarun Nethula and Jeetan Patel. Doull, though, said a four-pronged pace attack - Chris Martin, Tim Southee, Trent Boult and Doug Bracewell - was the way to go for the visitors.

"If they [spinners] are part of your four best bowlers, play them," Doull said. "The flip side is, the Indians play ordinary spin a lot better. Our four best bowlers are our four quicks. There's no point playing average spinners against very good quality Indian batsmen."

New Zealand's lean run in recent times owed in part to their senior players, like Vettori and McCullum, not meeting expectations, Richardson said. Vettori picked up just four wickets in his previous four Tests, while McCullum got starts in five of his last eight innings, but went past 50 only twice.

"McCullum is massively talented but massively overrated as well," Richardson said. "He just doesn't perform enough. When he does, it's staggeringly good and sticks in people's minds, but in the end it averages out to around about 30. Vettori once was a magnificent left-arm spinner. He is still very good but has lost the ability to take wickets. The key players have failed to be the catalyst for performance and the youngsters simply aren't at the level to make up for that."

McCullum, Vettori and Taylor are among the New Zealand players with IPL contracts and there could be uncertainty over their availability for part of the tour of England next year as it clashes with the league. Doull said they were able to play in the IPL because they performed for their national team on the world stage. "I wonder if too many players around the world forget that that is where they were predominantly first seen [international cricket], and that's where their loyalties should lie."

New Zealand are currently ranked No. 8 in both Tests and ODIs. When asked if they could only become a bigger force in the shorter formats, Doull said: "The stats are just not stacking up, to say we'll be a better one-day side. There will be the odd good performance like there was in the World Cup, but remember South Africa [in the quarter-final] was the only side we had to beat in a one-off situation. To play [and win] three or four games in a row, we don't seem to be able to do that."

Listen to the show here

© ESPN Sports Media Ltd.

Posted by VivtheGreatest on (August 22, 2012, 8:34 GMT)

I dont think either of the teams has the ability to take 20 wickets to win unless we prepare rank turners. @ Anand Lakhkar , Cpt Meanster's right, Kumble was nowhere in Warne's or Murali's class as a bowler

Posted by ramli on (August 22, 2012, 7:56 GMT)

NZ will struggle only if dust bowls are offered for tests ... otherwise, even India is on the transition with many youngsters in the team and may struggle ... all these out-of-form theories will wither away with one good performance ... NZ can still be competitive in this series ...

Posted by gothetaniwha on (August 22, 2012, 4:40 GMT)

Yeah NZ were to supposed to struggle last time and we only lost 1/0 in a three test series and from what i remember it was a slogging Harbajan century which got them out of a big hole in one of the tests

Posted by OttawaRocks on (August 22, 2012, 1:03 GMT)

I think NZ won't struggle and I say that unbiasedly as I'm an Indian fan. NZ in fact will draw the series and will have a chance at winning now that Dravid and Laxman are gone from the side. Hope I'm wrong and the Indian youngsters prove their worth.

Posted by Rajavel-cricket on (August 22, 2012, 0:33 GMT)

Dhoni is the useless player in test especially outside the subcontitent.. He is the only captain didnt make even single century out of the SC.. But still he remains the captain, I dont know why people dont understand the fact limited cricket is much different from test cricket.. If You keep dhoni as a test captain for his limited cricket achievements then its going to demolish india's test cricket. Get out from the test squad dhoni pls.

Posted by mikriket on (August 21, 2012, 22:58 GMT)

Richardson and Doull are 100% correct. NZ can't bowl India out for less than 400-450 and the NZ batsmen can't accumulate more the 200-250 per innings in 2 consecutive innings. NZ cricket is in for a dirty great disgrace.

Posted by Cpt.Meanster on (August 21, 2012, 22:57 GMT)

If you ask me personally, I would like to see a good, hard fought test match between India and NZ. Sure, NZ may look weak but the last mistake any sports team should commit is to underestimate the opposition. No matter how strong a team is, it should respect the opposition and value their competition. I hope we see an interesting test series. I expect NZ to put up a good show. I have immense respect towards Kiwi sport, mainly due to their rugby exploits. Ross Taylor should motivate his boys and it all starts with him. He's a very talented player and should lead with example. Best of luck to both teams.

Posted by Rajavel-cricket on (August 21, 2012, 21:31 GMT)

Do not under estimate kiwis. India is no longer great team in home without Rahul and laxman. This series going to be very interesting. I wanted to see india losing this series and Great test captain throwing out from the test team.. Dhoni must be kicked out from Tests at any cost,. Bring someone like Dinesh or saga for his position even naman ojha better suited than Dhoni.

Posted by   on (August 21, 2012, 20:30 GMT)

India obviously need to win both matches, they do not want a draw, as the win will bring them closer in the rankings to becoming NO.1 again hopefully. i am fully confident that nz wont be able to bowl India out, but at the same time India need to play smart, and make sure they have enough time and runs to bowl nzland out twice, best thing for India too do in both matches, is win the toss bat first, put up 650-700 in two days, and use the remaining 3 days where there will be maximum turn, and bowl out nzland. the bowling will win india this series, since they need to take wickets quickly. i am looking forward to see umesh yadav catch back his form, and take wickets like he did against west indes.

Posted by Cpt.Meanster on (August 21, 2012, 19:25 GMT)

@Anand Lakhkar: I didn't mean to put Kumble down. But even he would tell you he wasn't in the same class as Warne and Murali. He was a good bowler no doubt. That's what I meant. Woah ! looks like you are huge Kumble fan... picked that from your Facebook profile :D !

Posted by ReverseSweepIndia on (August 21, 2012, 19:24 GMT)

One thing which is eating me out is our bowling. We were never a strong bowling attack which could run through sides. But what made us get results were, we were batting heavy, will pile up 500+ most of the time and had decent bowlers who could restrain sides well below that total. Our obsession for fast bowlers has also make us lose bowlers who used to swing, just at good pace. Now either we have bowlers who bowls 145 but hardly swing it (Umesh, Ishant, Aaron) or others who swing it but bowls slower than Kumble (Pathan, Vinay, Munaf) even Zak has lost lot of speed in last year. We should not expect a miracle overnight until BCCI invest in fast bowlers. Till then our year old policy should do. Vernon Philander? Ever heard this name :)

Posted by ReverseSweepIndia on (August 21, 2012, 19:14 GMT)

I do not expect NZ to just roll down. If we see recent history of last 10-15 years, only team other than SA which have troubled us most is NZ. They didnt win anything, but they won't let us win too. We just could squeeze a test here & there but they have stood up mostly. Even last time Bhajji and Laxman saved the blushes from 15/5 or so.

Posted by   on (August 21, 2012, 14:15 GMT)

I dont agree this because India they have different team with out two walls

Posted by shantiratnamaj on (August 21, 2012, 9:37 GMT)

you mean NZ will struggle and they're not in good form? so what about India? Eight test matches lost in a raw and some of them heavy defeats. This series will expose some more of Indians problems in TEST cricket. Trust me NZ will win and all they need is confidence from past players like you.

Posted by SanjivAwesome on (August 21, 2012, 5:22 GMT)

Kiwis are young. And hungry to make a point. I think they will pleasantly surprise the Indians at home. So Team India better watch out for there is nothing more dangerous than an enterprising, tough minded competitor like a Kiwi. I am excitedly looking forward to this series!

Posted by beejaytee on (August 21, 2012, 4:56 GMT)

Truly insightful comments. NZ has batting issues? A dearth of spin options? Touring teams struggle in India? And all this adds up to a tough tour for the BCs, you say? Wow. Two incredible cricket minds at work there. What else did they say? The sky appears to be blue? Water often has a wet feel to it? The WI tour was disappointing, but a held catch here or there in the 1st Test, or another 50-100 runs in the 2nd and it all could have been so different. The WI also became a much better side in Gayle's absence, so his return was always going to bring some wins their way. Hopefully, NZ can toughen up a bit while Ryder's sorting himself out, and we can enjoy some similar results when he makes himself available again. For now, batsmen must put idiot advice about run rates and such out of their minds and bat long. Five sessions at 2-3 per over is about 400 runs, which gives the bowlers a decent chance at pressuring the young Indian batsmen. C'mon Black Caps!

Posted by   on (August 21, 2012, 3:41 GMT)

@capt meanster Dude Anil Kumble is one of the greatest bowlers to have ever played test cricket. He is the third highest wicket taker of all time in tests. You are saying he was not championship material. What a joke, the bigger joke is you are bracketing him with the likes of Raju and Prasad who were decent but never outstanding bowlers.

Posted by Cpt.Meanster on (August 21, 2012, 2:49 GMT)

@IndnCrktfan: I applaud you for your indifferent perspective on Team India's supposed outcome against England. But you are making India's bowling look a lot horrible than it actually is. Sure, we don't have high quality bowlers but at the same time we don't have mediocre ones either. We have what it takes to succeed in India. India have never had champion bowling attacks. Kumble, Srinath, Venkatesh Prasad, Sunil Joshi, Praveen Amre, Hirwani, Venkat Raju etc were all good but not championship material. However, we still succeeded at home because they were decent bowlers. Our youngsters need more time and patience from us fans. We as Indian fans are the least forgiving which is ridiculous. No player becomes world class over night. So cut some slack and get ready to watch England struggle in India. *wink*

Posted by rick333 on (August 21, 2012, 2:46 GMT)

@AjaySridharan..I believe it will be redemption tour for NZ. India has the haibt of struggling against lesser opponents like Bangladesh, WI, Kenya....

Posted by   on (August 21, 2012, 1:34 GMT)

india is overrated with no bowling, i don't see them taking 20 wickets either. the weakest bowling in the world currently is india, no one wants to work hard.thanx ipl and bcci they do not have to struggle for their places in team.

Posted by CrickFan82 on (August 20, 2012, 23:24 GMT)

yeah i think that India is over estimated, i wouldnt bet on them to pick up 20 wickets as well..ofcourse spinners have to play well. India cannot win the series if the batting doesnt fire..

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 22:48 GMT)

Agree India has a capability ranging from 1001/0 => 100/10 . Both in bowling and batting.

Posted by StatisticsRocks on (August 20, 2012, 21:44 GMT)

Normally I would have agreed that viositing team would struggle in India, but now I don't think so. Then we had Kumble and other quality spin bolwer who could roll over opposition but I still doubt from how and from where India is going to take 20 wickets needed to win a test match. Yes, NZ will have a nightmare bowling at Indians in India to the likes of SRT, Kohli, Viru, but their batsmen will score tons of runs as India has one of the worst bowling among test playing nations. I am really surprised at the some of my fellow overconfident countrymen. Mark my words as ENG will register their first series win in India when they visit later this year.

Posted by Cpt.Meanster on (August 20, 2012, 21:07 GMT)

India MUST respect NZ, irrespective of their status as a supposedly 'weak' team. India is in transition and there are some new and inexperienced players in the squad now. While it is unlikely NZ will win the series, they can still make India work hard like they did the last time they were here. I hope we get good pitches this time around. The one major reason for India failing miserably overseas is because of the batting paradises dished out. We need a pitch like the one from Lord's and yes its perfectly possible for Indian curators to create that kind of a surface. Just leave some grass will ya ?!

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 20:45 GMT)

I don't think there is much for NZ to do. Indian team will do whatever they can to win and loose the match. Just pray and India team will listen to your wishes.

Posted by nlambda on (August 20, 2012, 17:56 GMT)

Don't underestimate India. Given how our team plays I won't be surprised to see NZ 270/3 after day 1 :-)

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 17:46 GMT)

Look out for this guy Trent Boult.If nurtured properly he can be the next Bond for the Kiwis.

Posted by xylo on (August 20, 2012, 17:07 GMT)

Like AjaySridharan says, India have a knack of creating a contest with every team that it plays.. be it Zimbabwe, Bangladesh at one end of the spectrum, or Australia, and South Africa at the other end of the spectrum. I do not see NZ being pushed over easily. However, the current Kiwi team lacks the mojo of the past teams that put in 110% every time.

Posted by AjaySridharan on (August 20, 2012, 15:36 GMT)

Don't worry...India have knack of playing out of form teams into good form and boosting their confidence. I'm sure this time around wouldn't be any different either

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 14:47 GMT)

@Naresh. lol, get over it mate. India has a poor record overseas and the team is still mediocre, when compared to other top ranked teams.

Posted by SASANK360 on (August 20, 2012, 11:54 GMT)

@ashlatchem You are right. Just checked out the stats and perfomance of Patel. They are really good and will help him into the playing. Also Indian wickets will help him to a greater extent than the ones in NZ. In any case he must show a lot of heart here in India to be successful.

Posted by jonesy2 on (August 20, 2012, 11:53 GMT)

the way to played against the west indies was nothing short of an abomination. lost interest in what new zealand are doing to be honest i dont even know where to start in terms of what has gone wrong.

Posted by CARPEDIEM2WIN on (August 20, 2012, 8:43 GMT)

Even if they are capable of beating India, they won't. Coz those who are playing in IPL won't play well against India. If they play then they will not get contracts.

Posted by ramli on (August 20, 2012, 8:22 GMT)

I disagree ... taking 20 Indian wickets is still possible as Indian test team is also on transition mode .. Dravid and Laxman are not there anymore to pull India out of trouble ... their replacements are not good players of seam bowling ... NZ should beware rank-turning tracks given their inexperience in handling pin bowling ... good luck NZ

Posted by ashlatchem on (August 20, 2012, 8:16 GMT)

@SASANK360 on (August 20 2012, 06:28 AM GMT) Normally I would agree but as of late Southee has been woeful and Jeetan Patel has taken 46 wkts at 22 in the 1st division county championship this year. At first I thought they just had him in their as they were goin to India but after looking at the year he has had he thoroughly deserves to be in the squad... Not sure about Nethula though and NZ will get thoroughly smashed but regardless Jeetan has earned his spot in that squad.

Posted by ajayrcs on (August 20, 2012, 8:07 GMT)

Have any one seen Kiwi recent record? They will struggle every where.

Posted by cheguramana on (August 20, 2012, 8:02 GMT)

India shud not be complacent against the Kiwis. We have seen time and again that NZ 'punch well above their weight'. That was espcially evident in WC2011. Their unexpected aggression against SA knocked SA out of the tournament. If they can pull that off against India in a few crucial sessions, it cud put India under a lot of pressure.

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 7:37 GMT)

NZ has not been able to find proper replacements for players like Fleming, Cairns, Astle, Bond etc. The current players have not really displayed anything significant in the international arena. Also, the game of Cricket is just surviving in NZ. Cricket has to compete with other sports such as Rugby etc to recruit more young talents. Therefore, there is smaller pool of talent for the selector to choose from. Furthermore, I think in the next 10 years, there will be more players in the team, who will be from various ethnic background. Anyway, good luck to both teams.

Posted by Naresh28 on (August 20, 2012, 7:10 GMT)

This is a pep talk to boost a sagging NZ team low on confidence. At least NZ are showing respect to the Indians. Some Eng/Oz fans always mock India that Bangladesh are better than India. We have just beaten Pak at the U19 world cup in Oz in an elimination game and this is not on a "FLAT TRACK BULLY TRACK"

Posted by SASANK360 on (August 20, 2012, 6:28 GMT)

Daniel Vettori is an unfortunate loss for NZ. He was unlucky to miss out on injury. He was the only NZ spinner with lots of experience. No other spinner in this NZ squad ever played in India. This will make them handicapped and they will be low on confidence. So NZ will be better of fielding 4 quicks rather than including inexperienced spinner who will be treated harshly by Indian batsmen. Just like the last tour NZ should rely on Chris Martin for guiding their young seamers. Martin, Southee, Boult and Bracewell must be the attack. Boult showed some promise earlier and Southee is skillful. It Southee bowls to his potential he is dangerous. I agree with what Simon Doull suggests and 4-seamer attack is the best way to go.

Posted by Woodsy71 on (August 20, 2012, 6:03 GMT)

Patience is needed here. NZ are a good 2-3 years away from putting together a handy cricket side. My theory is that during this time there should be a sizeable number of fringe South African players, who can't get a game with the Worlds number 1 team, that will jump ship and look to qualify for selection in the NZ eleven. The result? We will now be known as the "Bok Caps", but we should win a few......and as a long suffering fan....im ready to do anything.

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 5:50 GMT)

Even if the selected India team were to beat NZ, they cannot be the best team that will tour SA in 2013. India has time on their hands between these two tours to prepare players for hard green tops that may have to be prepared or which may be found in high lying places somewhere in India. Our Batsmen & bowlers should be molded on such pitches and not keep playing on slow dirt tracks all year round. The result is that they cannot perform on fast pitches. India has got to learn sooner or later where they should practice to play international cricket. The IPL is not a training ground for them, especially on the grounds where it is played. Wake up India!!

Posted by Anwaruzz on (August 20, 2012, 5:15 GMT)

Bangladesh beat them 4-0 in five ODI, would have been 5-0 had rain not disrupted the fourth ODI. NZ batters would feel comfortable with pacers in Indian wickets and surprise the Indians with some big scores. India should chuck out the pacer and pack up the team with minimum 3 to 4 spinners, they are very uncomfortable playing spin in the sub-continent.

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 4:12 GMT)

There might be some struggles early mainly due to some inexperienced bowlers and some new batsmen. But their veterans and experienced players must resolve to curb their shot making to just bog down and play using and improving their skills. Rewards are theirs who work hard and once they have a few of them, NZ should make the other team struggle. India loosing 2 important players should make them as equal as NZ if it wasnt for India playing home. I would be surprised to see India win it all!

Posted by   on (August 20, 2012, 4:01 GMT)

they always struggle here in india,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

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