New Zealand in India 2012 August 21, 2012

Vettori's absence won't weaken New Zealand attack - Glenn Turner

ESPNcricinfo staff
19

The absence of left-arm spinner Daniel Vettori from New Zealand's Test squad won't have a huge effect on the outcome of the two Tests against India as he wasn't a primary wicket-taker in his team's attack, former New Zealand captain Glenn Turner has said. Vettori was ruled out of the Tests with a groin injury that he had picked up on the West Indies tour, where New Zealand lost the Tests and the limited-overs legs comprehensively. The first of the two Tests begins on Thursday in Hyderabad.

"Vettori has to bowl too many overs to take his wickets," Turner told DNA. "This is evidenced by his very high bowling strike rate of 79.6. He is very good at tying up an end, but needs wicket-takers at the other end to win games. His batting is useful, but his position in the order now appears to have settled in at No 7 or 8, positions that are less likely to make a significant difference."

Turner did not, however, feel it would be a cakewalk for India. "If the pitches take considerable turn, New Zealand will struggle. Their batsmen have still demonstrated an inability to bat for long enough periods to make big hundreds. Although India are obviously stronger, like most teams they are not immune from playing to the level of their opposition. Therefore, it would be unwise to write New Zealand off," Turner said.

Turner indicated New Zealand wouldn't be disadvantaged due to the lack of experience in their squad and the demoralising tour of the West Indies. "Experience can be overestimated when applied to both individuals and the assistance other current players are perceived to be able to pass on.

"I have little faith in the accuracy of making assumptions about collective mindsets (after the West indies tour). What I would say though, is that if individuals don't have good enough skills, they don't have genuine belief in their game, and all the positive talk is just mindless bluff."

Comments have now been closed for this article

  • nitsdcricketlover on August 22, 2012, 7:20 GMT

    Completly agree as his strike rate has alwaz been on d higher side..last evn he tied down indain batsman bt it was crish martain's spell at amehadab which caused concern 4 india..

  • anver777 on August 22, 2012, 5:30 GMT

    But i don't agree 100% ...... on Indian soil Vettori will be handy & he has shown that in the past, so i wonder NZ will miss him for this series too !!!!!

  • Cpt.Meanster on August 22, 2012, 5:07 GMT

    @MattyP1979: You got a point there. Dan 'The Man' Vettori has been a shadow of his former self lately. He's become more of a containing bowler than wicket taker. I wonder why. He's also been injured a lot the last couple of years. It's sad NZ won't have his services for the tests. But he will come back in time for the T20 fixture. I don't see any point in that. However, Vettori the batsman will be certainly missed by the kiwis. He's been their prolific run getter for some time now. Reminds me a lot about India's own Harbhajan Singh, who IMO is becoming more of a lower order batsman than the lethal off spinner he once was.

  • AnoMaLy on August 22, 2012, 4:05 GMT

    @MattyP1979 - Guessing the 2-0 loss hasn't sunk in yet? And when you say "inability with the ball" - to an extent true in recent times when they play on pace/swing friendly pitches but i highly doubt that will be the case in home conditions. Eng will get its biggest bum whooping ever come this november. Just sayin

  • on August 22, 2012, 2:42 GMT

    Well said Turner, ultimately a lot boils down to the ability of individual players. This was open for all to see during the 8-0 drubbing india got in away tours of eng and aus.

  • MattyP1979 on August 22, 2012, 1:26 GMT

    DV has been a force for NZ, but never IMHO a match winner (especially of late). NZ might struggle in these tests to dismiss Ind. Hope for a good series. NZ should take heart in their oppositions inabilty with the ball and all the pressure is on them.

  • on August 22, 2012, 1:25 GMT

    Hey, Strokerkiwi. You are so right: cricket is awesome!

  • playinrain on August 22, 2012, 0:26 GMT

    I'm a big NZ supporter, but I get the feeling some players have a reasonable performance every third game and that seems to be enough to warrant their selection on a regular basis. They should only stay selected on the basis they have the odd bad game, not the odd good game! On the latest results, Guptil and Boult would be the only sure places. On saying that, this line-up but for missing Gillespie and a second genuine opener, is about as good as NZ can front at the moment.

  • Meety on August 22, 2012, 0:25 GMT

    I would suggest that saying that Vettori's absence won't weaken the bowling, is a bit of a slap in the face to Dan! Probably will weaken the batting at least!

  • on August 21, 2012, 22:04 GMT

    I feel that if New Zealand grinds it out for two days, India will lose its composure. The same 'whitewash' saga went around when New Zealand toured India last time around; but as we know it, we had two boring draws!

    Indian bowlers cannot take 20 wickets, unless the opponents gift it to them. Our bowling attack is a big fat zero, perhaps even worse than the Kiwis.

  • nitsdcricketlover on August 22, 2012, 7:20 GMT

    Completly agree as his strike rate has alwaz been on d higher side..last evn he tied down indain batsman bt it was crish martain's spell at amehadab which caused concern 4 india..

  • anver777 on August 22, 2012, 5:30 GMT

    But i don't agree 100% ...... on Indian soil Vettori will be handy & he has shown that in the past, so i wonder NZ will miss him for this series too !!!!!

  • Cpt.Meanster on August 22, 2012, 5:07 GMT

    @MattyP1979: You got a point there. Dan 'The Man' Vettori has been a shadow of his former self lately. He's become more of a containing bowler than wicket taker. I wonder why. He's also been injured a lot the last couple of years. It's sad NZ won't have his services for the tests. But he will come back in time for the T20 fixture. I don't see any point in that. However, Vettori the batsman will be certainly missed by the kiwis. He's been their prolific run getter for some time now. Reminds me a lot about India's own Harbhajan Singh, who IMO is becoming more of a lower order batsman than the lethal off spinner he once was.

  • AnoMaLy on August 22, 2012, 4:05 GMT

    @MattyP1979 - Guessing the 2-0 loss hasn't sunk in yet? And when you say "inability with the ball" - to an extent true in recent times when they play on pace/swing friendly pitches but i highly doubt that will be the case in home conditions. Eng will get its biggest bum whooping ever come this november. Just sayin

  • on August 22, 2012, 2:42 GMT

    Well said Turner, ultimately a lot boils down to the ability of individual players. This was open for all to see during the 8-0 drubbing india got in away tours of eng and aus.

  • MattyP1979 on August 22, 2012, 1:26 GMT

    DV has been a force for NZ, but never IMHO a match winner (especially of late). NZ might struggle in these tests to dismiss Ind. Hope for a good series. NZ should take heart in their oppositions inabilty with the ball and all the pressure is on them.

  • on August 22, 2012, 1:25 GMT

    Hey, Strokerkiwi. You are so right: cricket is awesome!

  • playinrain on August 22, 2012, 0:26 GMT

    I'm a big NZ supporter, but I get the feeling some players have a reasonable performance every third game and that seems to be enough to warrant their selection on a regular basis. They should only stay selected on the basis they have the odd bad game, not the odd good game! On the latest results, Guptil and Boult would be the only sure places. On saying that, this line-up but for missing Gillespie and a second genuine opener, is about as good as NZ can front at the moment.

  • Meety on August 22, 2012, 0:25 GMT

    I would suggest that saying that Vettori's absence won't weaken the bowling, is a bit of a slap in the face to Dan! Probably will weaken the batting at least!

  • on August 21, 2012, 22:04 GMT

    I feel that if New Zealand grinds it out for two days, India will lose its composure. The same 'whitewash' saga went around when New Zealand toured India last time around; but as we know it, we had two boring draws!

    Indian bowlers cannot take 20 wickets, unless the opponents gift it to them. Our bowling attack is a big fat zero, perhaps even worse than the Kiwis.

  • serious-am-i on August 21, 2012, 20:58 GMT

    NZ may do good or bad, I have always have good respect for these kiwis. I hope NZ can pull up their socks and strive to become a team of force pretty soon. Ind will be with a new batting line up, so it won't be surprising if we see some nerves creeping in and giving in few scary moments for Indian think tank.

  • plow on August 21, 2012, 20:17 GMT

    For the first time ever I think I completely agree with Glenn Turner. Well said.

  • on August 21, 2012, 20:14 GMT

    As I child I used to love New Zeeland team with all legends like Lou Vincent, Nathan Astle, Shane Bond, Stephen Fleming etc. I feel bad for their current squad!

  • Blindedview on August 21, 2012, 18:29 GMT

    This series is not going to be as one sided as it is being made out to be.India have a habit of bringing out the best in opposition teams.Don't be too surprised if the kiwis give india a fight.the Indian batting lineup is untested and the bowling lineup is not potent and can wither away quickly.Both zaheer and ishant are injury prone.It could be 1-0 or 2-0(but very close) to India still.

  • 1st_april on August 21, 2012, 17:10 GMT

    Thats True....Vettori wasn't going to win Tests for NZ...Hobart is a prime example....NZ were far more competitive in the 2nd test against WI....surprise surprise...Vettori didn't feature...Bracewell/Boult/Wagner and Martin or Nethula...Vettori has been a great performer with the bat and thats the truth....play 7 proper batsmen...you might hold India to a 0-0 draw

  • on August 21, 2012, 16:11 GMT

    I wish there is competition or else Test cricket will earn more criticism. If anything the test matches should be exciting. And on the subject of playing at opposition's level, NZ don't have to worry since India Ranks No.1 in that department. Only glitch is sehwag but I am not sure about Sehwag's form. I am waiting to watch Ishant and Zaheer's bowling plus cheteswar pujara's and sachin's batting.

  • RyanHarrisGreatCricketer on August 21, 2012, 15:50 GMT

    Finally someone agrees that vettorri is overrated

  • stickywicketnick on August 21, 2012, 13:40 GMT

    Bring in Lou Vincent to the batting line-up and at least then we will have some experience back. He couldn't do any worse than the current lot.

  • strokerkiwi on August 21, 2012, 12:40 GMT

    Well said Turner, well said. NZ need to win the battle of the mind if they're to win the battle of the willow. They're a good unit in the bowling and fielding area, but they really need to put runs on the board to back it up. Isn't cricket awesome!?

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  • strokerkiwi on August 21, 2012, 12:40 GMT

    Well said Turner, well said. NZ need to win the battle of the mind if they're to win the battle of the willow. They're a good unit in the bowling and fielding area, but they really need to put runs on the board to back it up. Isn't cricket awesome!?

  • stickywicketnick on August 21, 2012, 13:40 GMT

    Bring in Lou Vincent to the batting line-up and at least then we will have some experience back. He couldn't do any worse than the current lot.

  • RyanHarrisGreatCricketer on August 21, 2012, 15:50 GMT

    Finally someone agrees that vettorri is overrated

  • on August 21, 2012, 16:11 GMT

    I wish there is competition or else Test cricket will earn more criticism. If anything the test matches should be exciting. And on the subject of playing at opposition's level, NZ don't have to worry since India Ranks No.1 in that department. Only glitch is sehwag but I am not sure about Sehwag's form. I am waiting to watch Ishant and Zaheer's bowling plus cheteswar pujara's and sachin's batting.

  • 1st_april on August 21, 2012, 17:10 GMT

    Thats True....Vettori wasn't going to win Tests for NZ...Hobart is a prime example....NZ were far more competitive in the 2nd test against WI....surprise surprise...Vettori didn't feature...Bracewell/Boult/Wagner and Martin or Nethula...Vettori has been a great performer with the bat and thats the truth....play 7 proper batsmen...you might hold India to a 0-0 draw

  • Blindedview on August 21, 2012, 18:29 GMT

    This series is not going to be as one sided as it is being made out to be.India have a habit of bringing out the best in opposition teams.Don't be too surprised if the kiwis give india a fight.the Indian batting lineup is untested and the bowling lineup is not potent and can wither away quickly.Both zaheer and ishant are injury prone.It could be 1-0 or 2-0(but very close) to India still.

  • on August 21, 2012, 20:14 GMT

    As I child I used to love New Zeeland team with all legends like Lou Vincent, Nathan Astle, Shane Bond, Stephen Fleming etc. I feel bad for their current squad!

  • plow on August 21, 2012, 20:17 GMT

    For the first time ever I think I completely agree with Glenn Turner. Well said.

  • serious-am-i on August 21, 2012, 20:58 GMT

    NZ may do good or bad, I have always have good respect for these kiwis. I hope NZ can pull up their socks and strive to become a team of force pretty soon. Ind will be with a new batting line up, so it won't be surprising if we see some nerves creeping in and giving in few scary moments for Indian think tank.

  • on August 21, 2012, 22:04 GMT

    I feel that if New Zealand grinds it out for two days, India will lose its composure. The same 'whitewash' saga went around when New Zealand toured India last time around; but as we know it, we had two boring draws!

    Indian bowlers cannot take 20 wickets, unless the opponents gift it to them. Our bowling attack is a big fat zero, perhaps even worse than the Kiwis.