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SA tour in balance at Dubai meeting

With Haroon Lorgat and Sanjay Patel set to meet in Dubai, ESPNcricinfo looks at the history of the recent dispute between CSA and the BCCI, and what it could mean for cricket

Firdose Moonda and Amol Karhadkar

September 16, 2013

Comments: 152 | Text size: A | A

Haroon Lorgat, the ICC chief executive, at the annual conference, Kuala Lumpur, June 26, 2012
The BCCI had problems with Haroon Lorgat when he was the ICC chief, and they haven't been forgotten © Getty Images
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Sometime over the next couple of days Haroon Lorgat, the Cricket South Africa (CSA) chief executive, and Sanjay Patel, the BCCI secretary, will meet in Dubai on the sidelines of the ICC chief executives' conference. For a meeting that exists almost under the radar - there is no publicised date or time or even agenda - it has immense significance for cricket, not merely in South Africa and India, but potentially the global cricket community.

At stake is India's tour of South Africa, scheduled for the end of this year; it is the headline series in CSA's calendar, worth approximately $15 million to the board. There is one catch: India's tour may not take place at all - or may do so in such a curtailed manner as to be almost meaningless.

In Dubai, Lorgat will attempt to convince Patel that the tour should go ahead. If he succeeds - and he will need a potent game-changer to do so - it will count as one of his biggest successes as administrator; if he doesn't, and the tour is called off, it might undermine his own position at CSA.

There are no clear reasons why India's historically close relations with South Africa went belly-up in a matter of months to the point where not only is this tour under threat but also CSA's stake in the lucrative Champions League T20. However, there are several well-known irritants that have been at play - an errant tour schedule, a letter of reference, elements of the BCCI's own internal politics - and, unfairly or otherwise, most have to do with Lorgat's appointment as CSA chief executive. This is also a story of staggering naiveté on the part of CSA in antagonising an old but prickly friend - and of similarly staggering arrogance on the part of the BCCI in indulging in what can only be called bullying, without much care for the conventions and niceties of the cricket world.

The BCCI's view on Lorgat is well known and its concerns over him being appointed chief executive have been admitted to on record by CSA - an amazing display of realpolitik given it was purely a matter for CSA to decide on. The antipathy goes back to Lorgat's time as chief executive of the ICC, when he backed the DRS and commissioned the Woolf Governance Review Commission, both of which India was opposed to in sum or in part. The BCCI viewed Lorgat as a provocateur; the opposite view was that Lorgat angered the BCCI simply by not toeing their line.

Cut to the 2011 World Cup, when India were one of the co-hosts, and the two flashpoints it threw up. One involved the ICC's attempts to secure tax exemptions - worth around $10 million - from the Indian government. The tax authorities had sought a set of documents from the ICC, and marked a copy of the letter to the BCCI. Srinivasan, who was then the BCCI secretary and India's representative in the ICC chief executives' committee, offered to pass on the relevant documents from the ICC to the tax authorities but Lorgat is believed to have refused to hand over the documents to him. They were later handed over by Campbell Jamieson, ICC's general manager (commercial) and the tax exemption was duly granted - but at a price Lorgat would not have reckoned with.

The other, more public, issue was the decision to remove the India-England match from Eden Gardens, as it was deemed unfit for the purpose, a month before it was to have been played. The man in charge of Eden Gardens, Jagmohan Dalmiya, suffered public humiliation. At the time he was on the fringes of BCCI politics; he is now the board's acting president.

Lorgat stepped down from his ICC post last year but the BCCI hadn't forgotten him; at an ICC board meeting in January, Srinivasan raised a point on ethics. "Mr Srinivasan requested that certain matters which relate to the former chief executive, Mr Lorgat, be investigated by the Ethics Officer." It was one sentence and lacked specifics but, placed as a matter of record in the minutes, illustrated that the battles were not over.

This was the backdrop when CSA began, early in 2013, their search for a chief executive. Lorgat was one of 200 applicants but by March he was shortlisted with three others. His CV was clearly the most impressive - apart from his four-year ICC stint, he had been involved with South African cricket in the past, as convenor of selectors and had more recently done consultancy work with the boards of Sri Lanka and Pakistan.

Yet CSA were obviously aware of the implications, vis-à-vis the BCCI, of appointing Lorgat and flew a high-level delegation, including its lead independent director Norman Arendse, to India in March to assess the mood. On his return Arendse revealed what the BCCI had told him. "They raised their concerns about Haroon Lorgat," he said with unprecedented candour. "They conveyed to us, with a fair amount of detail, why they would be opposed to his appointment."

There was no apparent threat to the tour yet but the net effect was a delay in the appointment process. The new chief executive was to have been in place by April; that became May, then June and July. It was clear that CSA had identified their best candidate but were wary of the reaction of their biggest partner. Relations were still friendly but the threat of rift and ruction was implicit.

Two things happened at this point to precipitate matters. On July 8, CSA announced the schedule for India's year-end tour - a series comprising three Tests, seven ODIs and two Twenty20s, apart from three warm-up games, and stretching from mid-November to mid-January. It was a schedule to thrill any cricket board hosting India, given the expected revenues from TV and ticket sales. There was one hitch: it seemed CSA had announced the schedule without the BCCI's approval.

The very next day the BCCI went public with its annoyance and the first serious doubts surrounding the tour were raised. However, the issue still seemed to be one of logistics - the BCCI wanted a shorter gap between two of the Tests, and perhaps two fewer ODIs - and the public stand was that an amicable settlement was being worked out. The tour still hung in balance because the FTP, the grid of all international fixtures, has not been signed by the BCCI, leaving all proposed tours essentially a matter of bilateral understanding.


Haroon Lorgat and IS Bindra at the ICC Executive Board meeting in Dubai, Dubai, April 15, 2012
The letter Haroon Lorgat received from his former ICC colleague IS Bindra upset the BCCI © Getty Images
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It is not clear what happened with the schedule - did CSA not take the BCCI on board? Suicidal, given the BCCI's method of working. Was it a matter of BCCI politics? Possible, with the board's leadership in disarray following the IPL corruption cases. Yet that scheduling glitch was overshadowed by the next bombshell.

In mid-July, with CSA yet to name its chief, it emerged that Lorgat had obtained a letter of reference from IS Bindra, a former BCCI president. Both men had worked together at the ICC when Lorgat was the chief executive and Bindra served as the principal advisor to Sharad Pawar, then the ICC president. Bindra typed out the letter on his own letterhead, marked it 'To Whomsoever It May Concern' and emailed it to Lorgat.

Bindra, the president of the Punjab Cricket Association but a waning force in BCCI politics, had long been critical of Srinivasan and his running of the board. In fact in June he had written to ICC Board members to "disallow Srinivasan from attending any ICC meeting" until the enquiry against his son-in-law's alleged involvement in the IPL spot-fixing scandal was complete - an act for which he may yet face disciplinary proceedings. Bindra was persona non grata in the BCCI - a letter of recommendation from him was a red rag to an already annoyed BCCI.

It's not clear what CSA made of the letter. Were they unaware of Bindra's status in the BCCI? A brief background check would have told them the reality. Did they believe - or were they led to believe - that there would be a power shift and Srinivasan would exit the stage, possibly bringing in someone more sympathetic, or less hostile, to Lorgat? It is understood that when South Africa expressed doubts, they were assured of a change in regime within the BCCI with the elections due to be held on September 29. "Once we come to power, we'll sort things out," a BCCI member is said to have told them. There were a lot of assumptions involved here: that Pawar would contest the BCCI elections, that he would win, and that he would listen to Bindra if he did win.

On July 20, within days of that letter being written, Lorgat was appointed CSA's new chief executive.

Even while unveiling Lorgat at the Wanderers, CSA president Chris Nenzani acknowledged the controversy but sounded confident that the upcoming tour, and the relationship between the two boards, would not be affected. Within days, though, the rumblings had started: the issue of Lorgat's appointment, and BCCI's reservations over it, was raised at a Champions League T20 meeting in London. There were also hints dropped that CSA would lose their stake in the tournament.

There was calm on the surface through August. India sent a strong A side to South Africa for a series of limited-overs and three-day matches, aimed at giving its less experienced players a feel of the conditions before the senior tour later in the year. Cricket fans believed the tour was on - so did South Africa's franchises, whose commercial and ticketing deals are blocked months beforehand.

On September 1, though, the BCCI dropped its own bombshell, announcing a home series against West Indies in November - a move that would effectively cut out or severely curtail the South Africa tour. Srinivasan said the SA tour was "definitely on" but added, darkly, "There were neither any discussions on the South Africa series, nor did any members raise any questions on it."

Events moved swiftly. On September 2, the dates were announced for India's tour of New Zealand - the first match of the tour would be played on January 19, the last day of the third Test in South Africa under the existing schedule. Two days later came the dates for the West Indies series - October 31 to November 27. As if that wasn't bad enough for South Africa, there was credible information over the past week of India staging a tri-series in December along with Sri Lanka and Pakistan. It was meant to be a back-up plan in case the South Africa tour fell through but it could well be the opposite.

Lorgat meets Patel with plenty at stake; India hold the aces, and have a plan B to fill their winter calendar. South Africa's only alternatives for Christmas and New Year are Bangladesh and Zimbabwe. India are the winners for the moment but the real loser could be cricket. By so brazenly flouting the conventions that underpin the sport, and asserting its unquestioned financial power when things don't go its way, the BCCI has set an unhealthy precedent that go against the cricket's very nature.

Firdose Moonda is ESPNcricinfo's South Africa correspondent. Amol Karhadkar is a correspondent at ESPNcricinfo

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© ESPN Sports Media Ltd.

Posted by Chasty on (September 22, 2013, 5:43 GMT)

As usual, the spectator, who just wants to watch high quality test cricket loses out because of boardroom power struggles

Posted by swarzi on (September 20, 2013, 13:47 GMT)

It seems that from every angle, Sachin Tendulkar contiues to be unnecessarily protected, by all and sundry in india! I believe like all those who suggested in their submissions that Sachin is the centre of this controversy. However, based on the content of the last set of submissions that I'm reading, I noticed that all references to Sachin are being excluded - I guess protected by Cricinfo too! But nobody can tell me he does not collaborate with the BCCI for the planning of (in his mind) such important mile stones as the one that is the focus of this controversy. I believe that he owns the highest percentage of blame in the matter. because, I am saying that this is yet another case of his arrant selfish behaviour in the game that he says he loves so much! Does he love it so much that he wants when he ends his career, for the entire game to die the same time too? What a Romeo and Juliet moment in cricket!

Posted by   on (September 20, 2013, 7:37 GMT)

7 ODI's in a series has been done many times not sure with the inclusion of 20-20. But if BCCI have a problem with the amount of ODI's why not just say no to that rather than no to the tour whilst adding extra cricket?

Posted by treut on (September 19, 2013, 8:42 GMT)

Is CSA not being greedy by unilaterally trying to squeeze NINE! limited over games in one series? Have those many games ever been scheduled before in a series?

Posted by treut on (September 18, 2013, 20:09 GMT)

@2nd_Slip I am being rude here? For responding to someone who suggested Aus/Eng/Sa "cut off" India. And as for unthinking - it may seem that way to you - but a major league baseball like setup in India for cricket is certainly one way forward. I mean that is preferable to me over India subsidizing cricket in every corner of the world and getting not much in return. And international players will vote for the idea with their feet. As for @babu has not the whole Aus/Eng/Sa breaking away from ICC already been tried in the 90's ? Did it work then?

Posted by 2nd_Slip on (September 18, 2013, 14:40 GMT)

@treut that's a rather rude and unthought-of statement. How about you imagine an IPL without SA,ENG and Aus players. A champions trophy without teams from those countries too and these countries playing against every other nation except India and finally these 3 big nations refusing to take part in the world cup if it has India in it(actually meaning the world cup become another Aisa cup).

Posted by landl47 on (September 18, 2013, 11:35 GMT)

The BCCI is the Donald Trump of cricket- everyone wants their money but no-one respects them. They have yet to learn that respect comes from how you treat others, not how much you grab for yourself.

This episode has not advanced their cause.

Posted by Zahidsaltin on (September 18, 2013, 11:25 GMT)

Now what next to expect of India. They have reached where they want to decide that who should run cricket boards of other countries. Other major boards should sieze to be greedy and get together to stop india's bullying behaviour otherwise cricket is gona suffer everywhere else than in india. ICC should take over the events where clubs from different countries participate just as it is the case with football where champions league of European clubs is a european body's business. And no country should be allowed to play a series which is not a part of a plan chalked out by ICC. In this way india won't be able to oblige some and hurt others.

Posted by Cricket_Mad_completely on (September 18, 2013, 10:52 GMT)

The BCCI is being the typical school yard bully who happens to be bigger than the other kids in the playground. India Vs SA is a headline series. It is what will determine the mettle of the youngsters vying for a place in the Indian team. The other boards of Eng, SA, Aus, NZ, SL, WI and Pak should get together and ostracise the Indian team and refuse to either visit or host them. Eng, Aus, NZ and Aus grounds are regularly packed at Test matches which cannot be said for those that are hosted in India. Take it one step further and ban their players from playing in the IPL as well. I love cricket, and no man or board is bigger than the game. What gives BCCI the right to act in such an autocratic manner? I supported the BCCI in their reluctance to accept DRS in its current form,such a stand is now validated following the Ashes series; but this is another matter altogether.

Posted by milepost on (September 18, 2013, 9:15 GMT)

@Subash, I respectfully disagree. The world does not need the BCCI. Australia, England and South African can pack grounds when they play each other and their domestic comps are doing pretty well. TV revenues are good too. If I am to accept that we must bow to the BCCI because of a dependence on their cash, I disagree entirely, that's not the reality. What I do hope for is that the BCCI attempt to restore some credibility and stop their petty behaviour because cricket fans obviously want to see India playing the best sides because they are a very good team, no doubt and great to watch. I'd actually argue that not even India needs the BCCI in its current state!

Posted by   on (September 18, 2013, 9:13 GMT)

@sccharan The tour schedules were not announced without bilateral discussions. The problem may well be the in-fighting in the BCCI that whoever was negotiating with CSA was suddenly no longer the right person to be talking to. You should be more concerned with protecting Indian cricket. You mention the IPL ... How short BCCI's memories are of how South Africa bailed that competition out by hosting it at short notice. BCCI would otherwise have lost billions and I assure you, South Africa, relatively, did not gain much financial benefit from that, in fact it probably did more long-term harm than good!

Posted by   on (September 18, 2013, 9:11 GMT)

Future repercussions if this tour doesnt go through. 1. england already pulled their players out of the IPL, SA would do the same. 2. SA will boycott the champions League, and without the 2 SA teams, BCCI will add on 2 other teams from qualifiers. (note, england doesnt have any sides involved) Aus may get involved (due to sideing with Eng and SA)

IPL will flop Champions League will implode (this reminds me a lot of Kerry Packers world series cricket. it lasted for around 2 seasons, and then closed. read about it on Wikipedia) eventually this is the future i see happening to BCCI if they dont play nice

Posted by Babu22 on (September 18, 2013, 8:35 GMT)

@treut: who said we want to fire the boss? Instead, what I want to see is that Eng, Aus and SA resign leaving the *boss* with no one other than Pak, SL, and may be WI to play with. What will the boss do, then? Eng, Aus and SA will set up their own company. One more thing. Till the other day the boss was neglecting Pak. If you think the boss will suddenly develop a love for Pak and then play cricket with Pak for 100 years as you say, you sure must be dreaming. Even the Indians will get bored.

Posted by   on (September 18, 2013, 8:10 GMT)

this is just my opinion so dont everyone jump down my throat all at once. according to what i see, the problem is between Srinivasen and Lorgat and the boards are supporting their own. hence the fixture thing. now, by india already speaking to WI and NZ and arranging matches for the same timezone as the tour of SA, it tells me that IND doesnt want to play SA in SA. IND has been bullying the ICC on a number of matters (DRS) and i think this is the limit. IND is being the spoilt child in cricket. they knew that there was a tour to SA months in advance, yet they speak to other boards knowing that it would affect this tour. and even tho they didnt sign anything with SA board, they should have at least tols CSA about what they plan to do, and not drop the dime like this. i hope that this is resolved, cos if India doesnt come down, the indian backing in SA will disappear, and the next time India does come, they will have no local support whatsoever....

Posted by   on (September 18, 2013, 8:08 GMT)

@sccharan well the FTP has been known for months so the "basic" deal was already done. India knew how long they would be travelling for it was only confirmation of what and how many matches would be played (this is if the BCCI is to be believed in that they weren't informed - like I have said before not sure I trust them). If I remember correctly the BCCI's origingal objection was that there was to much cricket going to be played so how do they rectify it oh yeah they arrange another tour just before and then bring the one after closer, thereby adding and condensing the cricket ? I'm guessing theres logic in there somewhere?

@treut - I know India vs Pakistan is a massive rivalary but considering how poor pakistan is at the moment would Indian Fans really not get bored of playing them ? or want to see their team compete against the best? I don't know just asking

Posted by treut on (September 18, 2013, 7:11 GMT)

@ Little_Aussie_Battler - get real! The idea of Aus/Eng/SA "cutting of" India is akin to three employees day dreaming about firing their boss. Also India and Pak can play each other every other day for the next 100 years and NOBODY in India will think for a moment about these "great" nations of yours.

Posted by Babu22 on (September 18, 2013, 7:10 GMT)

@Rohan, I am not living in Wonderland. I know money is important. But for a second, imagine the situation where SA, Aus & Eng play a league similar to IPL in Feb/March every year, and then they don't send their players for IPL, and they don't play India at home and away. I don't think IPL will sustain in this situation (with just SL players and Chris Gayle). The players playing in that alternative league will earn handsome money (more or less than IPL is relative; but handsome anyways). Because India is not playing these countries, there would be no India TV money, which I believe is the root cause of all problems. Again, I know money is important. But I am sure that there will be a time when people will say "We don't want your money. Thank you". If you think that cricket will die without Indian money, then you are fooling yourselves. It existed before Indian money came into the game. It will live on without India.

Posted by sccharan on (September 18, 2013, 4:38 GMT)

the best way to protect Indian cricket from being hijacked by trigger happy counterparties who announce tour schedules without bilateral concurrence. Is this not a convention in cricket? This is like announcing IPL in south Africa without CSA's concurrence. Everybody seems sympathetic to CSA commercial deals "which are signed months in advance". err, the basic deal with the BCCI also has to be closed out?

Posted by DeepBackwardSquare on (September 18, 2013, 4:20 GMT)

i'm sorry, but for the good of the game, it's really time, and I quote an newspaper headline from Australia recently 'It's time to kick this mob OUT' The history is one thing, but the future of the game at large is at stake here. it's so unfortunate, because the Indian players are all quality, and their teams are basically top 3 in all forms. I'd love to know how the Indian players, past and present feel about all of this... it seems the ICC is toothless here. Shame on any countries board who thinks it can control the game. Eventually the game will judge you harshly. The game will endure, but at what cost?

Posted by   on (September 18, 2013, 3:10 GMT)

The fact is simple that India wants to avoid another series white wash, 3-0 or 4-0 what ever applicable and that would mean cricketing crisis all over again in India with people calling for blood and for sure would see the end of the not so Great SRT, India can never compare to the might of the team world beaters like Australia (at their peak) and West Indies. On the contrary this team is rather poor in test as they could not even save a home series against a mellow England side.

Posted by Number_5 on (September 18, 2013, 2:35 GMT)

Lets hope for all cricket fans best interest this can be sorted. Pretty poor for the BCCI to play these sorts of games when the FTP has been in place for quite a while. These sort of self-serving political games are in no cricket teams best interest. Whilst its very true the BCCI control the cricketing worlds power-base through its generation of over 90% of the worlds cricketing $ it would be viewed better if more (some) of its decisions were made for the benefit of the game rather than political gain. A chance to see 2 of the worlds best Test teams play is something cricket fans around the globe would really enjoy. C'mon BBCI, its just not cricket..

Posted by Little_Aussie_Battler on (September 18, 2013, 2:08 GMT)

Would cricket be better off by not having the ICC at all and just go back to the individual countries boards organising matters?

It would be interesting to see what would happen if Australia, England and South Africa just cut off India. Would Indian cricket be able to exist without the great cricket nations as opponents?

ICC, if it is to continue, needs to go back to Australia or British control. Indian style of running things just leads to ruin.

Posted by treut on (September 17, 2013, 22:36 GMT)

@Jabulani your comment highlights your own ignorance on these matters: India have not signed the FTP. It is just a guide and makes no compulsions upon India to follow it. SL also withdrew from their SA tour so there is already president. Second, to suggest the WI tour was scheduled because of ST is conjecture with proof. I will not even bother answering that one. Also I don't think anybody should expect the BCCI to not use all its might and heft in commercial negotiations relating to tours. I'll say it again so you understand - India are under no obligation to tour SA. They are well within their rights to seeks terms from CSA that are favorable to their self interests.

Posted by cmartin on (September 17, 2013, 20:07 GMT)

This is not about Tendulkar. It is between the two boards. Rather than bashing Tendulkar you must concentrate on enjoying cricket. he will retire in the next few months.

Posted by android_user on (September 17, 2013, 19:53 GMT)

@ultimate truth, i think changing the whole dimensions of a big trst series for one individual or for the ego of men in suits is actually degrading the sport rather than promoting it. And like Ponting , sachin should be honoured on his 200th game in a proper eay. Rather than a circus act.

Posted by TheUltimateTruth on (September 17, 2013, 17:17 GMT)

@ Saad Amjad, But no other cricketer has played 200 tests -- not Lara, not Warne. I am no big fan of Tendulkar's, but I see no harm in celebrating his 200th test in his hometown. I would recommend that India return the favor to honor Kallis when he gets to his 200th test or when he is ready to play his last test match. Celebrating extraordinary milestones is a way to promote test cricket. As a small example, look at the guard of honor given by Smith for Ponting.

Posted by TheUltimateTruth on (September 17, 2013, 16:52 GMT)

@IPSY, why do you make up statistics when it is so easy to verify online in the cricinfo database. Tendulkar has more centuries than anyone else playing against test teams that are not Zim or Bang. His average is also comparable to the greats. I do think it is time he retired because he is not so great these days. But don't deny credit where it is due.

Posted by whatawicket on (September 17, 2013, 16:03 GMT)

in an ideal cricketing world all teams would play each other over a 4 year period. test cricket would and should be the pinnacle of the game with odis played before or after those tests. 20/20 should be removed from international scheduling. the ICC should shake the cricketing world and simply say to India you either do what the majority o the cricketing world want or we will no longer have you as a participant of the ICC. its gone before a joke no other world sport would put up with this. its made the ICC a mockery as it cannot run the sport for the betterment of the other countries.if nothing were to be done i would like the countries who disagree with the Indian stance to simple go it alone, forget about them let them run a 20/20 competition for 11 month of the year. then let find out just what isolation will do to their game. i for one am just fed up with them.

Posted by aplomb on (September 17, 2013, 15:55 GMT)

After winning the world cup what I believe current administration at BCCI is of too much egoistic and arrogant nature. Yes we have seen unfair treatment in past but we know that revenge cycle never ends. Although my humble request from other country fan is that don't start pointing evil towards BCCI for all thing so that it seems one mere addition in list even for right case. In this case two most powerful person at BCCI(Dalmiya/Srinivasan) are against Lorgat so clearly BCCI is not going to budge. CSA also didn't help the cause by making his decision on speculation(who would be at power of BCCI). Short term solution is CSA should say sorry and atleast we should get 3 test/odi. But on BCCI part, we have to understand that money brings evil along with fame. We have saw that due to ENG/AUS policy of past cricket only played in few countries now we don't want that even this is breaking into groups due to BCCI policy. My only wish is to witness last standoff b/w SRT/Steyn before he retires

Posted by IPSY on (September 17, 2013, 15:16 GMT)

There is no need for this Dubai meeting. If Haroon Lorgat and world cricket want any kind of cooperation from India right now - at this moment, all Mr Lorgat and South Africa have to do is to bilaterally organise two test series of six matches each against both Bangladesh and Zimbabwe, to run concurretly one after the other. This must be done right now, to replace the ill fated India tour. I am sure that nothing would hurt the BCCI more than Jaques Kallis getting a chance to play against some soft targets (as Tendulkar has been doing all his career to overtake Tendulkar's 51 (100s). This is the crux of the India- South Africa problem. Not one iota of administrative anymosity is invoved in this matter - let no one fool you.

Posted by sharidas on (September 17, 2013, 15:09 GMT)

We pride ourselves in saying that we (india) is the World's most populous democracy. And here we have the Board of the most popular game in the country, which is nothing,but, pure dictatorship.I see nothing here which can even remotely be said to be of any benefit to Indian Cricket and it is sad that it is the players and the cricket loving public who has to suffer in silence.

Posted by rohan8579 on (September 17, 2013, 14:25 GMT)

Babu22...you are one funny man living in Alice Wonderland it seems? Let SA, ENG & AUS pull out from ICC...but how would you pull out the individuals from these countries? There are instances that international players from these countries (Symond, KP, Watto, Bret Lee, and many others) preferred IPL over their countries game...Its easier said than done my friend...ask SA, ENG & AUS or any other board to pay these players $1 m for 2 months of playing cricket...do you think they can? IPL can...show me one tournament who pays that much of amount...yea yea every individual is patriotic and all that...but when it comes to financial safety of players and their family (wife, kids, parents etc)...patriotic becomes Family man....World Cricket doesnt stand a chance without the help of money which BCCI / Indian Cricket team generates...faster the world (ppl like you) accepts that...faster the solutions to all these pity problems! Cricinfo pls publish

Posted by PrasPunter on (September 17, 2013, 14:12 GMT)

for all these one-upmanship so brazenly displayed by the bcci, won't it be nice to see the proteas thumping bcci's team on the field ?

Posted by android_user on (September 17, 2013, 14:03 GMT)

@ultimate truth, has anything like this ever happened for greats such as lara and warne. tendulkar is idolised only in india. To everyone else he is somone who was a top batter. I think indians should understand that cricket is not just about tendulkar.

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 13:56 GMT)

If "by so brazenly flouting the conventions that underpin the sport", Firdose means the dominance of the ECB and CA for over 50 years, then absolutely yes, the BCCI is going against convention.

Please forgive the BCCI for doing the same thing the ECB and CA did forever while ruling over cricket through the Imperial Cricket Council. They would still be doing exactly the same thing if they could get away with it. No one ever mentioned the spirit of the game when England and Australia only played each other and only looked after their own financial interests.

It is also telling that South Africans have the audacity to lecture folks on what is "fair" and what is "correct", since they are known the world over as shining beacons of equality.

Posted by TheUltimateTruth on (September 17, 2013, 12:24 GMT)

What would have been wonderful is if India toured SA, extended the number of test matches to 4 from 3, and played one of the tests (Tendulkar's 200th) in Mumbai. That would have been such a great advertisement for test cricket and a remarkable example of cooperation between two friendly cricketing nations.

Posted by DeckChairand6pack on (September 17, 2013, 12:10 GMT)

Hopefully both parties can put egos to one side and do what is best for cricket and the cricketing interests of both of their countries. I am confident this can be done

Posted by TheUltimateTruth on (September 17, 2013, 12:07 GMT)

@Jabulani I agree that BCCI have no say in who SA wants to appoint as their head. But, at the same time India can't be forced to tour where they don't want to. FTP is a tentative plan. Considering that as a guaranteed tour plan is what is "asinine." India's interests are being hurt by the Lorgat guy and BCCI is fighting back. BCCI will lose in the long run if they keep this up, but SA and Lorgat are going to suffer significantly in the near-term. Unfortunately for you, India is a cricket-mad country and people will watch anything that has the Indian stars playing.

Posted by android_user on (September 17, 2013, 12:04 GMT)

just drop tendulkar for the sa tour. as philander,steyn and morkel will make it hard for him to get a hundred and we all know thats all indian batsmen care for.

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 11:58 GMT)

@bharatputra83 i do agree with you and fingers crossed that the series isn't cancelled. but if it is, then India and SA generally play each other 2-3 years apart so if this tour is cancelled and then the next one which is feasable if the two boards don't figure it out! then its like what 7-8 years that they haven't played each other, taking in the two years since last series, by which time this attack will most likely be different etc etc

However, I really do hope that it is sorted out although the way the BCCI have gone overboard in their reactions suggests to me that they want to teach everybody a lesson that they are boss! and the way CSA has reacted seems to suggest they're not gonna be bullied - hence butting heads and cancelling tour seems the only solution at the moment. But i shall put my hands together and pray that this is not the case.

Posted by bharatputra83 on (September 17, 2013, 10:38 GMT)

@ Nutcutlet Your comment made the most sense here. Although it's hard to expect hardened politicians to tow the line and actually have cricket at heart.

@ philander50 It's BCCI in the fray, not my nation. So please don't talk about my nation. Rather than being childish, the board is being egoistic, which comes with grown-up, rich, spoilt men with plenty of money and power. CSA were wrong on more than one count. One with the unilateral decision on the itinerary and the other being keeping silence for a surprisingly long time even after BCCI expressed their displeasure over it, and showing lack of interest and urgency even after BCCI started announcing new series with WI and NZ.

@ NixNixon We don't have to imagine the situation the other way around. We have been there when the english and then the australian boards were flexing their muscles in a similar way. These two boards didn't stop their ways despite protests nor did they admit they were wrong, did they?

Posted by bharatputra83 on (September 17, 2013, 10:12 GMT)

@ Keith Waters Come on buddy, the series isn't yet cancelled. Besides, just one series doesn't make a legacy. A player's/team's legacy depends on other teams and formats they have played too. Like I said before, it's not like this is the last ever series to be played between India and SA ever. More series will be played and the future and the legacy part will come too. Right now, lets just hope better sense prevails amongst both the boards and they don't disappoint us fans and the players get to show their mettle starting from this very series.

Well, yes. The fact is there is no side which has been completely right in this whole fiasco. That's what I wanted to point out to the other commentators here. They shouldn't single out only the BCCI for this, even though it's been somewhat of a fashion of late.

Posted by Andre117 on (September 17, 2013, 9:58 GMT)

Regardless of what happened, I have a problem with CSA having to consider the feelings of a cricket board from another country when they appoint people, regardless of the position.

Posted by Jabulani on (September 17, 2013, 9:44 GMT)

@ treut - your comment is asinine! Are you honestly implying that the BCCI has a say in who CSA elect as their CEO? The FTP was ratified by all parties and the BCCI have known of their previously accepted commitments for 4 years now! They wanted to make sure that SRT played his 200th test in India, and fair enough but they should then try to solve it via other avenues than ultimatums, bullying and rescinding on agreed upon obligations.

Posted by DaveT on (September 17, 2013, 9:41 GMT)

All of this politicking reduces the global customer base, the fans. Interfering with another country's officials selection, not paying players (in other places), is "just not cricket".

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 7:46 GMT)

It is a pity that cricket is at the mercy of individuals and on personal equations. RSA and India have had very good relations and India was one of the first country to invite SA after they were part of international cricket. I wonder why ICC cannot step in and bring about a solution and a thaw in the relations

Posted by ShanTheFanOfSachin on (September 17, 2013, 7:44 GMT)

ENG announced a tour schedule with hardly any practice games for IND and just 3 days in between Tests. But thats alright? Every board decides the schedule on its own convenience and FTP/ICC is just almost for the sake of it..

How often ENG,AUS or SA (or even IND for that matter) have toured ZIM or BANG???

BCCI is no angel and is well known. But lot of people in the media seem to have grudge against BCCI and starting picking them on every possible opportunity even if the issue is about lack of accuracy on DRS in a game between ENG and AUS! That shows whats going on in world cricket

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 7:32 GMT)

@bharatputra83 - agreed

Except the legacies part any team that beat Aus in the packer years first thing is always but Aus where weakened. Trust me us Saffa's who grew up watching the likes of Rice, Le Roux, Van der Byl, Ken McEwan, Jimmy cook not be recognised because they where never tested in the test arena know what forging legacies is all about.

However reading this article and another about the BCCI I get the feeling they don't care are happy just playing IPL and killing off international cricket. Cause they will still make money.

As for who is right BCCI or Lorgat No one really besides not sure I can trust what politicians say

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 6:35 GMT)

@Afta: "... Money brings arrogance and that's what BCCI is made of. ..". Well said, Afta. I fully agree with you. The same way, "veto" power used to make England & Australia arrogant in the days of yore!

But tell me what make Lorgat so arrogant to sit on his high horse for more than 2 months, and jeopardizing a potentially mouth watering tour, the finances of CSA & the Franchisees, and becoming a co-contributor in souring an extremely cordial relationship between two set of great cricket fans?

Posted by chadster on (September 17, 2013, 6:27 GMT)

CSA needs to know and understand that they have fixtured to many games. 7 ODi's? thats ridiculous, Pro20 has killed out the passion and excitement in the longer format of the game. i agree with BCCI, there are too many games, if my memory serves me correct, India plays WI and Pak, not sure who first, those dates clashes with the dates SA has drawn up for the India tour. and what about the one day rest between games? how can CSA release fixtures if there is nothing agreed between themselves and BCCI.

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 6:08 GMT)

It will be a big disaster for those who consider test cricket is the ULTIMATE, if Indias tour to the Proteas is shortened or even cancelled.It should have been an interesting series between an in form Indian side and the number one test team.

Posted by treut on (September 17, 2013, 5:53 GMT)

What no one seems to understand is that India are under no obligation to tour any country they do not wish to. No if and buts about that. If the BCCI have no say in who CSA pick as their CEO, then I am sorry CSA also have on say in which tours the BCCI pick.

Posted by humdrum on (September 17, 2013, 5:23 GMT)

@Babu22:Wonderful idea. Now,if only you can work out the financial survival angle of all these teams,it would create a sensation.Box office receipts do matter you know,so that the money can be ploughed back into the game,and the financial security of the players ensured.Remember the cricketers from various countries(except India) who went on rebel tours to SA in the late seventies and early eighties purely for the sake of money ?What makes you think it won't happen again ?

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 5:03 GMT)

Page 2 of 2 .....Continue from Previous

Both parties are professional bodies carrying financial intentions. I am not sure about seriousness by CSA for this particular tour. I won't surprise if CSA cancelled this tour. Cricket doesn't stop here. Cricket governing bodies have definite division from so many years and a gap is widening now. There is one group of AUS, ENG & SA at one side now leaving others on different platform. The former is having supremacy attitude over later and their approach must need to be changed for the benefit of cricket. We fans need to understand this and should wait with great patience.

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 5:00 GMT)

The article well exploited internal differences between the BCCI in favour of other party CSA and attempted to be a judgemental in a disagreement of 2 parties. There was a simple issue of even management and most of us know how it can be done in day to day life. We need to make MOU just to adhere to the agreeable conditions. But Article script writer feels otherwise saying that there was only one hitch by CSA & tried to make unidirectional opinion of entire cricket lovers about BCCI. Article also hides the fact about CSA's public announcement of itinerary and moreover blaming BCCI to go to public with its annoyance.

To be cont..... Page 1

Posted by humdrum on (September 17, 2013, 4:56 GMT)

I suppose Lorgat thought that he would stay on at the ICC indefinitely,and so could needle the BCCI as he pleased.Fair enough. CSA knew what they were getting into when they elected him,so why the wailing ?Lorgat has mouthed platitudes about doing what it takes to improve the strained relations,but is yet to walk the talk.So why brand the BCCI as the big,bad bully of international cricket,after all the choice of not playing India can always be exercised.

Posted by Babu22 on (September 17, 2013, 4:51 GMT)

Firdose, I refuse to believe that cricket could be the loser here. I can see how it will win. SAF are no strangers to not playing cricket (they didn't play for 20 years because of Apartheid). All it needs is guts. Let SAF pull out of the ICC. I'm sure Aus and Eng will do it too. Without players from these three countries IPL will die out. Stage an equivalent of IPL in Feb/Mar (one year in Aus and one year in SAF). It will benefit both Aus and SAF (need not play T20s during first class season). Players will not suffer because there will be money. In the meantime, don't play any series with India either in India or away. Without these countries, India can't keep playing against SL and WI every day. Do this for three years and you will see how cricket will win. Cricket in fact will flourish. One must understand that cricket survived before Indian TV money came into the game, and it will survive without that now. That TV money is the root cause of all problems. Cricinfo pls. publish. tks.

Posted by srinideva on (September 17, 2013, 2:58 GMT)

OMG! I love BCCI... They are simply awesome..they are here to help the indian cricket not world cricket, icc is there to do that...they already making too much money from india and blaming the indians...keep in mind the sponsor for the icc tournaments are there for the indian public...show some respect guys...Its CSA fault, without consulting with the indian counter part, they made the call..well you have to suffer for it..sure.

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 2:51 GMT)

BCCI had no right to intervene in the internal elections of another cricketing board is the view that a few naive people might hold.. I mean come on.. You guys see how the politics work around the world.. America dictates the way elections run in the third world.. Big multinational corporations gobble up smaller companies to get rid of competition.. BCCI will act in its interest and why shouldn't it?? It probably should not have curtailed a tour.. Perhaps the best thing for CSA to do would be to totally disallow the tour to go on until BCCI toes its line.. The view that BCCI holds all the cards is probably not right.. BCCI with all its might is kind of digging its own grave here.. Test cricket does not seem to be of importance at all.. CSA should just start the avalanche off.. The other poorer boards might want to follow suit..

Posted by Zahidsaltin on (September 17, 2013, 2:33 GMT)

LET us see if CSA has gutts to stay independent or if they give up their sovereignty to indian might. The way india is dictating world cricket, England and Aus need to have gutts to stand by them. Isn't india's behaviour gone out of hands and they are bullying every one as they like. At the end it is only CSA, AUS and ENG's fault. And they don't even care to do it public that India wants to decide who the chief exective of other boards should be. Shame

Posted by Afta on (September 17, 2013, 1:57 GMT)

Surely cricket is the loser. Lorgat's appointment may be a curse for the BCCI, because it cannot manipulate or influence CSA the way BCCI wants to. Money brings arrogance and that's what BCCI is made of. Cricket has become such a commercial venture that its so sick to see even bollywood in it. This is Indian Cricket MASAALA style. Its high time the ICC puts an end to the dictates of the BCCI. Otherwise, sooner or later there's going to be splits among the ICC members. I wouldn't want ICC and cricket run like Indian politics..? Remember match fixing..? Who was the cause of bringing disrepute to the game..? Indian bookies..!

Posted by TengaZool on (September 17, 2013, 1:08 GMT)

BCCI does have issues - almost like someone who had been bullied but couldn't do anything about it and suffered humiliation silently for years. Now BCCI is grown up but the traumatic stress of yesteryears has turned it into a bigger bully. It can be fixed but there must be a leadership change - both at ICC and the BCCI. Aside that it was extremely foolish of CSA to publish an itinerary in thorny times without BCCI's approval (if that's true). Also, you might argue that BCCI shouldn't have any say in CSA's internal appointments. But if you are the major source of income to all boards, BCCI probably felt they did have a say - almost like head office having an opinion regarding regional appointments. CSA added to that illusion if you may, by sending a team who noted down BCCI's reservations but apparently didn't do anything about it - why would you fly a team over if you didn't care or were not prepared to take into account BCCI's views? That was the last straw I reckon that started this.

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 0:48 GMT)

Many are making assumptions and generalizations and provocative comments, and avoiance of certain issues (if it suit their arguments).

1. BCCI & Srinivasn are NOT one and the same; though the latter is having his say now. He cannot be there for ever.

2. South Africa is NOT the only strong team in test cricket. These rankings are transient.

3. Even when SA were banned, legacies were built and legends were made.

4. No one want to answer why Logart was sitting onhis high horse since 9th of July. SPosted by Keith Waters on (September 16, 2013, 14:56 GMT) @Jose Puliampatta the point is that the BCCI have no right to tell CSA who they can appoint !! And so Srini is NOT the only villain.

5. The respective Boards's need not be the position of the cricket lovers in both countries.

If we all play "The Game " created & started by two egotistic persons on either side, we are unwittingly aiding and abetting THEM and massage THEIR egos, instead of re-instating a long standing friendship.

Posted by   on (September 17, 2013, 0:47 GMT)

@Clifford Adams,: You said,

"...Their manoeuvres, arranging tours with the West Indies and New Zealand, narrowing the gap to 'exclude' South Africa was indeed a clever move, in their own interest ..."

BCCI (though not my favorite, but have to agree on THIS) started making these moves ONLY when there was no response from CSA to their objection dated 9th July. If CSA had responded with any reasonable amount of urgency; things would not have come to this pass. Tour would have gone ahead with very minor changes. (May be two ODIs less & change in the sequencing of Tests and ODIs. Such changes always had been agreed upon bilaterally and amicably, before bilateral tour schedules are published / announced in the past -- between any two countries)

Posted by KingOwl on (September 17, 2013, 0:08 GMT)

Why are people complaining about India leveraging it financial muscle? Isn't that what everybody with financial clout does? Or is it bad because it is India and not England or some other 'Western power'?

Posted by SHER-A-PANJAB on (September 16, 2013, 22:51 GMT)

Don't call India ,If they do not have a valid time for S.Africa ,I think SA should arrange another IPL for INDIA then every one will rush to SA...because Indian Board sends teams for huge money not for traditional cricket .this is all about personal...Anyway ...not good for cricket

Posted by raf1 on (September 16, 2013, 22:22 GMT)

The BCCI seems to be good at alienating other boards and it seems it is just a matter of time before they will alienate the most important stakeholders in Indian cricket-- the fans. An appeal to BCCI from an Indian fan-- we want to see marquee series like the one with SAf so please stop these shenanigans and give us quality over quantity. Don't forget you were the aggrieved party during the bygone era when the top two dominated and now that the tables have turned please don't try to behave like them. What comes around goes around. Try to be a leader not a boss.

Posted by BravoBravo on (September 16, 2013, 22:19 GMT)

IND is bailing out to play with any country as a visitor unless it is NZ. The recent two super whitewashes in tandem were too much to swallow, the third whitewash will be hard to swallow and the humiliating series loss against ENG in their own backyard. And my prediction is that IND will try too bail out of the future AUS tour as well. It is a shame to use this kind of tactics, very cheap. Simply IND cant compete with any team in Tests. They are just a mediocre team for last 80+ years. They have to cover this mediocrity by some excuses to prevent the demise of IPL.

Posted by Sheikasif on (September 16, 2013, 22:12 GMT)

gbqdgj, Reality check mate-There are other countries that will jump on an opportunity to play India ex SL. Pak will definately take any scraps that are thrown their way by India. So will NZ, Ireland, Bangladesh, Windies, Afganistan, Scotland, Zimbabwe and even England and Australia if they have capacity. SA is not all mighty as they want us to believe. Problem is with Lorgats arrogance and BCCI will have none of it. India has no problem with SA in general. There is only one person in the current setup that is singlehandley ruining decade old good relationship. Trying to put the blame on BCCI is not fair when the root cause of the whole problem is just one person who seems to think that he owns Cricket SA. SA fans supporting him is only a boost to his ego.. Lorgat needs to do the right thing here-apologise for his oversight, consult and agree on a balanced series mutually beneficial to both nations and fans.

Posted by rmjayna on (September 16, 2013, 21:47 GMT)

Why didn't CSA consult India on the schedule of their Tour. How can only one side decide how many matches and when. Surely both sides should have a say. It works with other teams and countries.

Posted by Witty365ca on (September 16, 2013, 20:34 GMT)

THIS IS NOT CRICKET BUT PUR POLITICS. Mr Haroon Lorgat seems to have sided with the opposing camp ( Bhindra camp) of dirty Indian BCCI politics (especially Srinivasan camp) . There was no need for Mr Haroon Lorgat to play politics and side with any camp and because of which SA is now made to pay the price . Indians need to put the Mr Srinivasan in his place. His arrogance is unbearable & intolerable and continues to spoil the environment and is setting bad precedent in the world of cricket. LOSER IS CRICKET & CRICKET LOVERS who will miss out on great cricket between two strong cricket playing nations.

Posted by philander50 on (September 16, 2013, 19:07 GMT)

As a saffa fan I respect India as a competitor, but as a cricket fan, I find India to be too childish to resolve the issue with CSA, even if I do think CSA were in the wrong with the itinerary.

Posted by StrangeWays on (September 16, 2013, 19:05 GMT)

@nutcutlet.. Not a word from CSA ... And according to you they are ruining cricket? The worst thing is that they (cricinfo) are cotinuously posting your biased comments.

@ Neal 88 What exactly should CSA say? Sorry for giving a man you don't like a job.. Which is compliant with South Africa's affirmative action policy. It's their fault? v

Posted by arun25 on (September 16, 2013, 18:28 GMT)

Excellent article! I agree that BCCI is bullying CSA but this was a gamble on part of CSA too, hoping that there will be a shift in power at BCCI. I really dont think this is going to go down well. Fans are the victims here, I wish CSA could have handled it more diplomatic by consulting the schedule with BCCI. Now that BCCI have got a reason(CSA did not consult the schedule), they are not going to give up that easily.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 18:22 GMT)

India had no right to interfere and dictate to CSA re the Lorgat appointment. Their manoeuvres, arranging tours with the West Indies and New Zealand, narrowing the gap to 'exclude' South Africa was indeed a clever move, in their own interest and not principled and in the best interest of cricket. The latter is definitely the loser. Time will heal wounds and as the saying goes, what goes round comes round. This current saga shapes like India winning the "2013 World Admin Cup" against the chokers.

Posted by Nutcutlet on (September 16, 2013, 18:19 GMT)

Riddle: how do you make cricket a football? Answer: give it to the BCCI & CSA to kick about. Neither board can care about the wider cricketing world, supporters in the two countries, and those neutrals elsewhere, all of whom have been looking forward to the four Test series between two strong sides. Instead, we have to witness an unseemly clash of monster egos & politics, thus relegating cricket to a kick- about for the playing out of old scores. Who loses? Only the game of cricket -- but that is the furthest thing from the minds of the protagonists. I'd put them all in a room, presumably in Dubai, lock the door & tell them not to reappear until thay have reached a conclusion which demonstrates that they (a) have the game of cricket at heart (b) honours the FTP to the satisfaction of all. It's about time all concerned grew up. They are all behaving like children & should know better. Last point: you only get this type of nonsense when there are spoilt men involved. Women know better!

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 18:11 GMT)

I don't know why most of cricinfo's articles have this tone of accusation against BCCI. I know this comment won't be published because this is going to be in favor of BCCI.Is it BCCI's fault that the other nations cannot do without a series against them? Do you guys say all the other boards look after each other and only BCCI is selfish? They just see Lorgat as a man who is inclined to oppose BCCI which is not entirely false either and CEO is the most important post of CSA. Every board has their own choice just like the BCCI to pick your friends and enemies. They just cannot blame the BCCI for their inability to generate their own revenues.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 17:30 GMT)

Indian arrogance is beyond comprehension. Most of this stuff is related to internal BCCI politics and pique at not getting their way when Lorgat was at the ICC. How can anyone seriously defend the BCCI's position, since it basically boils down to "CSA, you're not doing what told you to do, so stuff your series". I think it's time the BCCI got taken down a notch. I'm with milepost on this one.

Posted by Greatest_Game on (September 16, 2013, 17:29 GMT)

@ Sheikasif. Did you not read the article? Did you not understand it? Lorgat was not appointed when the schedule, which the BCCI knew well, was released. This is not about Lorgat, and not about CSA. This is not a war between India and South Africa, or a war between their fans. It is about Srinivasan, Dalmiya. Nothing else. That does not mean BCCI, or India, but just those few rich, powerful men who never played cricket.

Posted by crisis_man on (September 16, 2013, 17:09 GMT)

As an Indian, it is becoming embarassing to face the opinions of the cricket world. The high headedness of srinivasan led BCCI & the utter contempt they show towards the fans would make any righteous person's blood boil with anger. To cancel a series which had a spectacular schedule with the ODIs starting before tests, 3 practice games, and a boxing day test to top it off is shambolic to say the least. this is the tipping point. sonething has to be done to teach srini a stern lesson!

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 17:01 GMT)

milepost, you don't live in this world or what? Imagine what will happen if the US stops cooperating with other countries in the world; it's other countries who lose out; not the US. It is even worse if they stop working with BCCI; because everybody is after money; which all these writers conveniently ignore and start bashing BCCI. While I find nothing great about how they conduct themselves, no board in this cricketing world can boast of doing an 'angel's job for their countries and other countries (other than with India of course); Because, money talks... and it will always get it's due! It's a hard truth in this world and unfortunately, BCCI might even flex their muscles to get what they want when BCCI cricket team travels to other countries, next time. So, keeping BCCI happy is, for now at least, the best thing most of the boards can do...

Posted by cric_fan123 on (September 16, 2013, 16:57 GMT)

There is another point which has been missed: Though it was known Lorgat appointment was problematic and even SA sent in a team to pacify BCCI, they seem to forget two golden words - "No comment." Instead they went on record telling the world how BCCI was pressuring them. What did they think will happen? did they expect media to polarize/pressurize BCCI into doing the right thing? They could've instigated some backroom dealings instead they chose this way. And BCCI, doesn't take nicely to people saying things in public, it is construed as a complain.

Posted by bharatputra83 on (September 16, 2013, 16:13 GMT)

@ Keith Waters Well for the legacy part it's not as if India will never play SA ever again. Also, it's not as if one's efforts are useless and count for nothing if they are against other cricketing nations. The ICC members are pretty good teams as well. So the legacy part will come, with other nations, with SA in future tours and hopefully, if better sense prevails, with this very tour as well.

Let's call a horse, a horse and admit that there is indeed friction between Lorgat and BCCI. The reasons, though may seem foolish, are affecting the cricket being played between these two countries. So of course both of them will have to tread carefully so as to not to tick each other off, and make things public only after approval from both sides, that's all.

As for the why, well that's what the whole article is all about. Its well explained, how the egoistic bigwigs can be miffed at the slightest provocations and how things can hightail rapidly into disaster. Nothing's cancelled yet though.

Posted by Neal_88 on (September 16, 2013, 15:54 GMT)

As it turned out to be its the SA board that didn't follw rules and regulations while announcing the tour so the BCCI is doing things that are in its power. But SA board should have pacified the matters but it choose to remain a silent spectator. So its the SA board's fault totally that is happening here. But the cricket itself is suffering that i agree . SA board should take inititive as quickly as possible to resolve the matter otherwise the SA tour won't happen and if somebody says don't play India than i think their players also won't play for them cuz IPL is in India not anywhere else.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 15:45 GMT)

@ bharatputra83 I'm not saying India are scared of playing SA. However, try this would Gavaskar maiden test series been as legendary if he had done it against england as opposed to the Windies? right now SA ar the best team and if the players want international recognition they need to perform against the best. And I agree with you that there will be no financial impact to India but they're will be no legacy.

I find this comment quite amusing "They will definitely go on with the next planned series, provided both boards tread carefully."

So its only definte it both boards can agree so exact same situation as now? as long as CSA do what the BCCI want.

What I find interesting is the BCCI knew how long the tour was going to be months ago - its not much different to any other tour that India goes on SA so why are they so upset when the itineraries come back? sure they may want less ODI's for more 20-20 or test or vice verce but why cancel?

Posted by sgma on (September 16, 2013, 15:34 GMT)

Shameful conduct on part of BCCI

Posted by bharatputra83 on (September 16, 2013, 15:20 GMT)

@ Keith Waters As for records, India played pretty well in the last series in SA and so did SA back here. But both don't have much to brag about. Plenty of reason for BCCI to make this series happen. Which is why its ridiculous that people are commenting about BCCI cancelling the tour because its scared. Its a new team and they don't have much baggage. Both the BCCI and team India were eager for this tour, but sadly, a series of unfortunate events have stalled the said plans. I hope we get some good news soon and the series proceeds further. Looking forward towards an exciting contest.

Posted by bharatputra83 on (September 16, 2013, 15:16 GMT)

@ Keith Waters It wasn't as if India wanted to play weaker nations and avoid a strong nation like SA. It's just that India is playing the available nations for now. The itinerary has WI, NZ, PAK, SL on board. Aus and Eng are busy with their own series and commitments and are having series with India later on. That leaves only SA and BD alone. So India used all the available options.

SA is not the only strong cricket playing nation. India is playing everyone else. Besides, it's not as if India will never again play SA ever. They will definitely go on with the next planned series, provided both boards tread carefully.

There won't be much financial impact for India if they don't play SA exclusively. We are a cricket crazy nation and money will keep pouring in for BCCI if they plan series with all other nations.

Posted by YS_USA on (September 16, 2013, 14:59 GMT)

Today, BCCI is opposing foreign Board appointments. Tomorrow, they will dictate foreign pitches and then, they can even force foreign teams to lose. Where will this end? But, nothing foreign boards can do except depend on goodwill and good conscious of Indian board and Indian people, which will eventually win.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 14:56 GMT)

@Jose Puliampatta the point is that the BCCI have no right to tell CSA who they can appoint !! And if they do where does that stop, will the BCCI then tell CSA who they can pick for their team? Remember CSA tried to tell England that they couldn't pick Olivera didn't end well for SA. And if the BCCI will not play SA cause of Lorgat that means they will only play if he's is not there but what happens if the next official says something the BCCI doesn't like? no playing untill the temper tantrum baby gets its way again?

I never once said that India where afraid to play SA that is your Assumption, what I actually said is that it would be a shame if they didn't play cause in the future when people look back they will say that the Indian players have not tested themselves against the best and only feasted on the weaker opposition, there will be no legacy for them Like Gavaskar or Tendullar, Dravid, Laxman etc etc

Posted by reality_check on (September 16, 2013, 14:51 GMT)

@icfa. Here in lies the problem. No other board is objecting to Lorgat's appointment except BCCI so other boards don't have any issue visiting SA.

And your other point that BCCI has the money. Yes and just having the money is not the problem. it's the immature my way or the highway attitude that comes with having a lot of money is the problem. Simple answer... grow up.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 14:37 GMT)

This is why cricket will never challenge soccer,basketball or even baseball as a global sport. People looking after their piece of the pie and the fans be damned.

Posted by indianpunter on (September 16, 2013, 14:21 GMT)

Cutting your nose to spite the face. The BCCI never ceases to amaze me, to the levels they can stoop to. Do they, for one millisecond, think about what the cricket loving public in India want to see? A "thrill a minute" series vs SA or a 'yawn and miss" series against SL? The MCC behaving boorishly when they had all the power and money, is no reason for BCCI to follow suit. With power, comes responsibility. But then absolute power corrupts absolutely. As an indian fan, i hang my head in shame.

Posted by crick_sucks on (September 16, 2013, 14:05 GMT)

This is not a trivial tiff between the 2 boards. People must understand the gravity of the situation. BCCI is the strongest board. You must accept this and try to play nice with them. It is your foolishness if you think you will take them head-on and come out trumps. Just take this present fiasco as an example. Look how BCCI has planned its moves. It has come up with series by taking in the next best available countries. It has played very smartly. And on the other side you have egoistic leader with nothing but foolish pride to bring to the table. Make no mistake BCCI will go ahead with the planned series with WI, NZ and Pak/SL. Who will lose, it will be CSA. BCCI and others will benefit as they will be still playing good competitive cricket and fans will watch it. Meanwhile CSA will sit crying over their foolishness.

Posted by KSCric on (September 16, 2013, 14:02 GMT)

This is not good by BCCI. However, we are living in a real world, this has happened and it will keep happening. It is BCCI today, it was ECB and ACB in the past, and it will be someone else in future. As an example, is there any country in the world which has a choice before what USA says? BCCI is Cricket's USA currently

Posted by crick_sucks on (September 16, 2013, 13:58 GMT)

I have a better idea. Why not invite CSA to play in India? We just want cricket between the 2 countries. Where it is played matters next as long as the series is on. Until the present CSA chief is in office SA will keep suffering. The sooner their board realises this and sack the man, more pain will come their way. All the fools here who say don't play India can't get a simple fact in their head. Who will sponsor your series? Most series are sponsored by Indian companies who will want to see India play. No India no money, honey.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 13:39 GMT)

I am an Indian and am a big fan of the Indian cricket team. However I have to admit that I am ashamed about by board continued belligerence towards any opposition, legimiate or otherwise. In certain matters such as the DRS, the BCCI stands vindicated for now, but in this particular incident, the BCCI is clearly out of place meddling with the internal affairs of another board. Yes, the other boards must get together to confront this monopoly that is clearly detrimental to the sport.

Posted by Chak-De-India-Deux on (September 16, 2013, 13:07 GMT)

I think BCCI should not have acted this way. I am highly critical of ECB and CA on certain matters but this time I have to admit this is really brazen and bizarre. The sad part is that poor Tendulkar's name has been dragged though the mud and all this critics have had a field day!! What I really find astonishing about the BCCI (and some other Boards as well) is the longevity of some of these officials who run the board - they keep coming or going out of power but seeing Dalmiya / Logan / Bindra / Pawar etc mentioned is feels like time has stopped over the past 30 yrs. Sad part is that tax payers in every cricketing country pay a lot of out their pockets (99.99% don't even realize) to make sure Cricket exists but these officials (BCCI leading the way) only care about themselves and their ego. Shame. India should have played 4/5 tests and 3 one-days in SA.

Posted by milepost on (September 16, 2013, 12:30 GMT)

Why don't teams just stop playing India until the BCCI sort out their stuff? Then Sachin can have his send off against India A. That's a simple solution isn't it? The notion that cricket needs the BCCI is nonsense. Indian people, fans unparalleled anywhere in the world, who love their cricket like no one else does, might then send a wake up call the their board. This is an ongoing internal problem, not one for the ICC or the other boards. It is up to Indian cricket fans to tell their board to get their act together and stop trying to boss the cricket world.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 12:22 GMT)

@Keith Waters on (September 16, 2013, 8:19 GMT) You are implicitly making too many assumptions. 1. India did not say that it would never play SA again. Even now, they have not completely shut the window; only reduced it from two months to just one. (Hope at least THREE tests will be scheduled during that period).

2. You are assuming that Lorgat will be the CSA chief for life. He need not be. India never had any problem with any of the CSA chiefs, starting with Bacher. I don't anticipate any problem with any one else either. For example, though Dave Richardson is in favour of URDS, he never tried to act high & mighty with India, and India's cricket bosses have no major issues with him.

3. You are assuming that Indian team is afraid of playing against South Africa. The new breed of Indian cricketers are not afraid of any team, from any part of the world. So is the case with Indian fans too. The fans had been and are still looking forward to the tour, even if curtailed for sad reasons.

Posted by GASyed on (September 16, 2013, 12:19 GMT)

Being a cricket lover, I really feel ashamed when the other boards are begging and trying hard for an Indian tour home or away. Just a matter of few million USD? Where is the self-respect? Why not SA settle a tour with other teams or organizing a tri-series like the Indian are planing to compensate the tour. Come on guys, stand up against the supremacy of the BCCI.

Posted by ramli on (September 16, 2013, 12:13 GMT)

What if there is not a FULL series in SA? Why should BCCI bring more money to SA? There are so many teams in the world to play. Take it or leave it. So, let us play a short and sweet series in SA and move on to other places. Let SA arrange a truly LONG series with other teams to satisfy themselves.

Posted by GASyed on (September 16, 2013, 12:12 GMT)

Its really a matter of shame for all the cricketing nations how the BCCI is controlling the affairs of ICC. Haroon Stood against BCCI and now is being humiliated by the Indian. Let the ICC desolve and humbly request BCCI to take control of the game since they are the only nation to promote the game.

Posted by ramli on (September 16, 2013, 12:05 GMT)

The_bowlers_holding ... BCCI or Indian cricket fans don't care if team loses abroad ... for BCCI it will bring revenue anyway ... for fans, if the series is well fought, it is bonus. So, if Indian team is thrashed, we always know to bounce back. So, what if the SA series is curtailed? There are enough teams to play in the world. Only SA should feel unfortunate if they don't get a full series ... just hope to tour India next for a longer series, hopefully???

Posted by hitesh288 on (September 16, 2013, 12:01 GMT)

People just like to bash BCCI as they are more successful then any other board, dont forget until recently ECB and ACB were holding all the powers so tables have changed. All successful businesses have bashers as they are jealous. SA should have consulted and agreed upon the itinerary before making it public, they know that they were wrong. BCCI may and it seems they did have different plans and if they had been consulted I am sure a compromised would have been made. I donr think BCCI is worried about India getting bashed, recent record shows they can stand up to conditions abroad and have capable players. No boards arrange tours or not arrange tours for fear of losing, thats absurd.

Posted by sherishahmir on (September 16, 2013, 11:59 GMT)

One of the most awaited series of the year looming to be ruined down due to some personal likes and dislikes, which would be v harmful not only for two boards but also for cricket fraternity. India records against SA and Australia is never great whenever they played in their backyards, now a new Indian team has developed since the last Australian tour of India and since team India performance is simply unprecedented in all tours. Hope the matters will be amicably resolved and the series would go ahead with full of thrill, excitement and actions for cricket fans.

Posted by NixNixon on (September 16, 2013, 11:59 GMT)

For those of you who believe the BCCI's actions to be correct - please imagine the situation the other way round. It is not fair to cricket. Something like this will never happen in soccer, brazil or eng for example dont tell FIFA what to do and in cricket it seems that BCCI does what it wants. For those of you you believe BCCI to not be at fault, here is a list of some of their actions: have a problem with DRS, have a problem with pakistan, have a problem with pakistan in IPL, had a problem wit the broadcasting rights when eng toured there and also wanted to boycott the eng commentators, dont want to release their players to play in other t20 tournaments. They simply do what they want.

Posted by android_user on (September 16, 2013, 11:55 GMT)

it is a bad scene....it will hurt the cric lovers....this type of childish clashes will give a black mark to the cric.....and also it will make some wound in fans....so it will lead to somany changes to fans that is whether or not fans will think that wat is the purpose of watching this....it iz also the clashes of....politics so pls don't mix the game with any political like things....so don't lead this cheap clash to terminate the wonderfull series...this is a rqst to both bcci and csa

Posted by ball_boy on (September 16, 2013, 11:49 GMT)

Stop acting as the big boss and concentrate on welfair of cricket.Because of you guys cricket will not have a good not too distant future.Stop alienating the people of India.Your egos are not important when compared to cricket.A conglomeration of 10 nations out of which more than half the boards are cash strapped wat you think in the near uture better players will come from those nations in this game of cricket where the purse hoders decides whom to giva an oppurtunity.Soon the quality shall fall,no Indian shall feel watching the Indian team behaving as a king in a mud pit.Surely then the revenue shall and BCCi will become defunctory .You enemy is not your supposed allies your enemies are short sightedness a failure to assess the waning interest of cricket fans,Surely since some of you are businessman ,you would have heard of the term-Marginal demand.When the supply is more than the demand, the demand wll drastically fall.Its applied on Choc factories workers to stop steal

Posted by deoshatwar on (September 16, 2013, 11:39 GMT)

unfortunately, BCCI can survive only on IPL too, even if all other countries come together and try and give BCCI a run. We Indians are really ashamed of this board. We demand that all BCCI board members must have played at least 5 Tests for India. Hope Sachin does something through his clout in the parliament.

Posted by android_user on (September 16, 2013, 11:22 GMT)

BCCI should grow up.they should stop playing politics in cricket. the way they are reacting to this issue is so childish. They should grow up and think about the players involved in the series. Ok if they are financially strong but that doesn't mean they should act like bullies.Lets respect the game of gentlemen and put aside our personal issues.

Posted by CalmIndiaFan on (September 16, 2013, 11:15 GMT)

@ Madras_boy:

Is this what you want to see - Srini win over a CSA and cancel a terrific series? Do you want to bring feudal bias and expose our Indian weakness of me and my-kind before any logic? Is this about India vs the rest of the world or is this about rising above petty politics and doing what's best for cricket?

You truly disappoint me with the regional bias.

Posted by CalmIndiaFan on (September 16, 2013, 11:07 GMT)

(contd ..)

Should the BCCI curtail or cancel this tour, millions of fans will be bitterly disappointed and will blame BCCI. I personally will hold BCCI responsible for letting ego and greed prevent Indian fans from a terrific cricket contest. I will also cancel my subscription to the Star Cricket HD and ESPN HD channels should the tour not go ahead as scheduled.

Please schedule a full series of cricket between India and South Africa.Indian cricket deserves no less.

Regards,

Posted by CalmIndiaFan on (September 16, 2013, 11:06 GMT)

My mail to BCCI:

Dear Sir,

I am extremely pained to read reports of BCCI curtailing or canceling altogether India's scheduled tour to South Africa in November.

This would be a huge mistake - for the fans and for the board.

Cricket in India is going through challenging times with the Board's incompetence and mismanagement of the various cricketing related issues. There is constant infighting within the Board's senior management and within it's various factions.

In all this, the die-hard fan has been eagerly awaiting the India - SF test series in SF. Everyone in the world has been looking forward to this con "test" between the world's 2 best teams. The last series between these 2 teams in SF was a cracker and the fans deserve another full series.

(contd..)

Posted by The_bowlers_Holding on (September 16, 2013, 11:06 GMT)

Narendra Kumar on (September 16, 2013, 10:41 GMT) India are running scared of another thrashing overseas there ability to prevent that is what they have to prove. For the record since they starting playing tests India have only had ONE decade where they have a positive win:loss ratio and overall have thw 7th best of 8 long term test sides. Winning a WC equates to winning about 5 ODI games which is the equivalent of one test.

Posted by femer on (September 16, 2013, 10:55 GMT)

I am really saddened by such politics. Its seems that this is becoming a personal thing and bad blood between a few individuals. Such people shouldn't be above the sport and have no right to ruin it. Additionally this is a bad precedent. Very ssoon elite umpires will also start giving decisions in favor of india, or else face the axe. Then perhaps we don't need the ICC. Plus, people want to watch the best play the best. I think such inefficient administratorsforget the fact that South Africa is the best test nation. Vey soon people will lose interet in the Game. Financial clout or not, no single country has the right to rule the non sporting aspects of any sport.

Posted by itsthewayuplay on (September 16, 2013, 10:53 GMT)

This is the problem of having one Board so financially dominant in cricket. That coupled with perceived slights to it means that the BCCI can effectively hold any other board to ransom. As Peter Parker's Uncle Ben once said to him, 'with great power comes great responsilibility'. The BCCI has to look beyond personal issues and base its decisions in the best interest of Indian and international cricket. Has the BCCI proven it can act responsibly in any major issues e.g. DRS, not properly recognising Kapil Dev's contribution to cricket, scheduling a 2 match series so 1 player can play his 200th test at his home crowd etc. Just as players have to demonstrate form and fitness to be selected, there should be a requirement for selectors / BCCI members to demonstrate they are fit to be part of organisaton with an international standing.

Posted by android_user on (September 16, 2013, 10:41 GMT)

India won 2007 t20 world cup in SA,reached final of 2003 world cup as well and dominated last test series there.Apart from a series win SA have not done anything notable in india.

Posted by android_user on (September 16, 2013, 10:35 GMT)

Indian team doesn't need to prove anything to anyone.They have won 2 world cups.How many have SA won?How many times have Eng won?A couple of bad series doesnot make a team bad.

Posted by tickcric on (September 16, 2013, 10:30 GMT)

Poitical fights, nobody is innocent here. It's just that the Bcci are flexing their stronger muscles and it's hurting the Csa more. Cricket surely is the biggest loser...If only both parties were a little more pragmatic. Considering the situation it was hasty of the Csa to announce the fixture before working it out with the Bcci. They could have perhaps accepted reducing the Odi series to a 5 match one. 7 match bilateral series are anyways unnecessary overstretch. And the Bcci are taking it too further just because they can! This episode will only underline they are a bully and in process they are squandering a 20 year old relationship. A mistake which can cost them later... I feel sorry for myself & all the cricket fans who were waiting for this series.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 10:30 GMT)

@ bharatputra83 i never said they don't care about money but what will happen is fans will get bored of watching their team play weaker opposition and will eventually get fed up of the suggestions that their team is to scared to play the best, and fans will demand that India test themselves against the best, and the BCCI do want India to be called the best team in the world but they will never happen if they refuse to play the current best team in the world. This will have a huge financial impact.

As for SA's record in India name a country which has a better record there? also how as India fared in SA for comparison?

Posted by humi_cric on (September 16, 2013, 10:27 GMT)

I was waiting for this contest for months to see how young and exciting Kohli and Pujara will play against steyn and co, ahhhhh, very disappointed with the current situation. Our boys (don't want to write word batsman, I am a Pakistani team supporter) played horribly against SA, ALSO, so I want to see a real contest between bat and ball, although bowling attack of India is bit weak, but I love to watch how Indian batting perform in alien conditions against world best fast bowling attack. For me, two tests are acceptable, instead of nothing. Please don't cancel this tour. No need of tri-series btween Ind Pak SL while in Feb/March Asia Cup

Posted by madras_boy on (September 16, 2013, 10:24 GMT)

CSA should have asked for BCCI approval before announcing the schedule ! CSA is trying to act smart ! BCCI, being the powerhouse of cricket will not be easy for them to handle unfortunately. Srini should be back at the helm shortly to give a fitting reply to CSA.

Posted by JustIPL on (September 16, 2013, 10:17 GMT)

As of date there is no direct communication b/w BCCI & CSA and it is most likely that Lorgat will ignore Patel and carry on with the conference. CSA appointed Lorgat ignoring BCCI's stance and they will keep on doing it but it will save india from playing more tests against the world number one test team.

Posted by gbqdgj on (September 16, 2013, 9:50 GMT)

@Sheikasif - you are kidding right? SA is by far and away the best test side playing at the moment and if India wish to climb back up the rankings...which given the fact that they lost 4-0 away to England and 2-1 away to England would suggest they are a long way from being ranked second let alone first...indicates to me that in test cricket India need SA far more than the other way around.

Posted by gbqdgj on (September 16, 2013, 9:48 GMT)

I have a solution...India should play SL and only SL (as they are the only cricket board who seem to bow down to the BCCI). They should then set up a new world ranking where India presumably will be the number 1 side in the world/ At some point when SL overtake them, obviously this will become a problem for BCCI but not to worry as they will then find another team to bully in to submission and they can set up their own breakaway ranking system from their own breakaway system.

Posted by muzika_tchaikovskogo on (September 16, 2013, 9:32 GMT)

As an Indian fan, there's nothing I'd love more than seeing the young batsmen being tested against the best attack in the world today. Unfortunately, the game has become hostage to the machinations of petty politics. One just hopes that the BCCI stops embarrassing us with its brazen abuse of power in the future.

Posted by bharatputra83 on (September 16, 2013, 9:29 GMT)

It's funny how so many people keep trying to undermine the Indian cricket team. Earlier, they said this fiasco was because of Sachin and when that is ruled out, they are now saying India is afraid of losing. The article above beautifully highlights all that has been going wrong and it's more than enough reason for egoistic people to block a series. It's not as if the SA players have much to brag about their tours to India either.

@ Keith Waters If you think the administrators around the world think about anything except money or egos, you are mistaken. They don't care about the bragging rights of their players at all. Their agenda has always been clear to everyone from the start.

Posted by FazliEB on (September 16, 2013, 9:24 GMT)

I am a fan of all forms of cricket especially Test matches and would love nothing more than to be at Newlands to watch South Africa and India battle. However I believe that boards of control and administration are losing the plot, they must remember that they are there to serve the best interest of the game, this flexing of power is well and truly not in the spirit of the game.

I would go as far as saying that the series if not honoured in its totality should not take place, ultimately SA is the current number 1 test side, perhaps our administrators should remember this...

Posted by bharatputra83 on (September 16, 2013, 9:23 GMT)

Like I have been saying from the start, both the cricket boards have played their part in the current crisis, but everyone is only blaming the current favourite punching bag, the BCCI. I have an idea. Lets blame the Syrian crisis on the BCCI too.

The situation could have been averted by timely intervention as soon as BCCI expressed displeasure on the fixture announcement without their approval. Alas, its too late now. I don't see the series happening unless one of them backs down and it definitely won't be the financially stronger BCCI who also have a backup plan installed. CSA wants money, BCCI wants an ego massage. Due to the ego play of both the boards, its ultimately cricket that is suffering.

Posted by yoogi on (September 16, 2013, 9:22 GMT)

Well, we are already not playing pakistan in a series, and with SA added to that list it could mean more India SL matches. May be we should try to tour Ireland.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 9:17 GMT)

BCCI is a Bully. I hope CSA has the guts not to bow down to this bullying. I think India's current generation of cricketers wil retire with a lot of money but no leagcy of winning anywhere that matters. BCCI is ensuring that that's how their careers will be.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 9:07 GMT)

CSA has pushed themselves into a corner with very bad political moves. Yes, the BCCI is a bully , but they are bullies who hold the cards and CSA needs them more than they need CSA . Cricketing aside , CSA must be blamed for bad politicking. The argument that the fans will be unhappy is inaccurate , Indian fans will watch anything involving India, they are that crazy. Cricinfo can attest to the page views and traffic of their coverage of the India A tours . Indian players will play every minute of ANY match as long as they get the chance to play. Simple . CSA have only themselves and Lorgat to blame.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 8:46 GMT)

The main thing many of us were looking for in this "historical update" is the action/s taken, or at least the response TO BCCI's objections about the "unexpectedly-announced-&-unapproved-by-one-side" tour plans, BY CSA from July 9th, till date; that is for MORE THAN TWO MONTHS !

It is extreme naivete on CSA's part to rely on a letter from some one in India, who has not only a become a spent force, but also a 'persona non grata' within the current BCCI dispensation.

How can CSA 'depend' on a person, who can not size up the situations (and people) with some sense of reality to lead their national cricket? It is just beyond me. Let me make it very clear that I am NOT a fan of the current BCCI Administration. And, beyond the Indian team, an ardent supporter of South Africa & West Indies. So, I'm NOT trying to tow the BCCI line!

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 8:46 GMT)

@vish57. You argued; "ICC should slap penalty and ban India from playing any international cricket for 1 year if they have any power in world cricket."

The key phrase happened to be ..."IF they have any power in world cricket" !!!

Posted by Pathiyal on (September 16, 2013, 8:46 GMT)

We have already lost confidence in bcci....

Posted by wakaPAK on (September 16, 2013, 8:27 GMT)

India can not face SA in a test series... would tarnish their best team image...

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 8:20 GMT)

Please let some sense prevail and we have atleast 3 test matches

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 8:19 GMT)

@ Sheikasif you may be right an SA may need the finances that playing India would generate but in the long term if India refuse to play SA supporters will get bored of watching India play weaker opponents and yearn for their heroes to be tested by the best! When people sit down to talk about the history of the game it will always be mentioned that potential greats, like Kohli, Dhawan, Jadeja etc etc never tested themselves against the best of their times. So yeah they will have died rich men but they will have no Legacy there will be no stories of how they went toe to toe with the Greatest pace attack of their generation in testing conditions eg the legendary sunil gavskar's debut series against the Windies! and surely that is more important than money?

Posted by EnglishCricket on (September 16, 2013, 8:15 GMT)

South Africa don't attract much of a crowd especially for the test matches. I remember when Pakistan toured there for tests and the stadiums were basically empty. India want to play where there is great interest.

Posted by PeterJerome on (September 16, 2013, 8:12 GMT)

Suggestion to Cricinfo: To make your comments section count, plz include 'agree' 'disagree' options. It will have a telling effect on the traitors of the game. Do your part Cricinfo.

Posted by 504429641 on (September 16, 2013, 7:52 GMT)

Test series with SA is the most anticipated/awaited test tour ever since India lost 8-0 away to Eng and Aus. It is definitely a loss to test cricket fans if the tour is cancelled. If it happens, then there should atleast be 3 tests, 3 odis and 1 t20i. Lets hope the outcome of this Dubai meeting will be positive.

Posted by jimbond on (September 16, 2013, 7:52 GMT)

There may be lots of internal dynamics involved, but from a layman's perspective, it boils down to a few aspects. First, BCCI, has been a bully over the past few years, just like the English and Australian boards had been earlier. Second, Lorgat has been playing with different kinds of politics at the ICC level, and had been succeeding. Hence BCCI had no reason for liking him. In this context, he has been naieve enough to finalise and declare the schedule for the series without consulting BCCI.And this is an important series for CSA for its commercial value. Well, given this, BCCI will not lose a chance to make Lorgat grovel.

Posted by lesley95 on (September 16, 2013, 7:45 GMT)

Everyone in power does as it likes, IOC dictates its policies to the the Indian IOC because of the power it holds. So why should not India show its power in the ICC. As a cricket lover I would love to see an Indo-Pak match rather an Indo-SA match and Sachin play his 200th test in India.

Posted by Sheikasif on (September 16, 2013, 7:41 GMT)

Vish57, Gets your facts right you pretender. Rules of the game is that both nations need to consult on the schedule. India is a superpower in ranking and generating revenue. India is doing SA a favour by agreeing to play them. If India doesn't play, SA can always ask lowly rated countries like yours to fill in the gap. SL is more competitive that your country anyway. Fact of the matter is that India doesnt need SA but SA surely does.

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 7:40 GMT)

India holds all the aces and money. Backup Plan B also in place. But according to cricketing ethics it is not fair to a nation. I am an Indian but I will lose Interest and confidence on BCCI if they call off or curtail the SA series... A meaningless curtailed series is equal to no series. It is better to sit home for the players than playing against Srilanka... We have witnessed 'n' number of series between us. No country should plead because the other has money. It will be embarrassing. Appointment of Logart is their internal matters. BCCI is not supposed to make others bend for its tune. In conclusion: "We Indians want this tour to happen, atleast 3 Tests and 3 ODIs.........."

Posted by Socratis on (September 16, 2013, 7:39 GMT)

For Lorgat, there is a Aesop's Fable, where a boy standing securely on high rock, abuses a wolf (BCCI). The wolf merely stopped to reply 'Coward! Don't think that you can annoy me. As far as I'm concerned, it's not you who's taunting me, but the place (ICC Chairman) on which your're standing!"

Lorgat annoyed BCCI and its official when he was chairman now he or for that matter anybody should complain. Lorgat should not complain when he is paid in same coin. CSA intentionally selected him and brought onto themselves.

If BCCI has a clout, might as well use it, I don't think other board will not do it if they have one. Disclaimer: I don't think BCCI is filled with angels, but cannot always blame BCCI.

Posted by Sheikasif on (September 16, 2013, 7:32 GMT)

Get down from your high horse and apologize Mr Lorgat. Everyone ones to see India/South Africa..If your ego is holding you back, do he right thing by resigning. Accept that you were wrong in not consulting with India. Time to realize that country comes before self Lorgat. Hope to see Lorgat coming to senses and giving us the opportunity to watch two great teams in action...

Posted by   on (September 16, 2013, 7:24 GMT)

Let CSA not begg in front of BCCI and embarass itself.. No one wants to see another ODI against Sri Lanka Anymore.. Its become so boring...

Posted by bighit14 on (September 16, 2013, 7:15 GMT)

Hate to see the Politics controlling the Cricket. Amol has rightly said, whatever is the result, it Cricket which is a clear loser. If the SA tour is cancelled, I hope most of the Indians will lose interest in cricket.

Posted by vish57 on (September 16, 2013, 7:08 GMT)

Iif Indian tour of SA is cancelled or curtailed for non criticketing reasons, it is a shame to me as Indian becasue of BCCI's arrogance; BCCI may dictate terms becasue of money power but criciket should not suffer that too a very healthy relation with CSA for more than 2 decades should not go to drain in no time; Let Team India Play 3 test matches, atleast 3 ODS and 1 T20 games . 19 playing days with equal rest days, the tour could be squeezed between the WI & NZ tour. Dont make CSA beg to BCCI and embarass the nation of India. Let wisdom prevail up on BCCI, it is a breach if BCCI choose not to tourSA and ICC should slap penalty and ban India from playing any international cricket for 1 year if they have any power in world cricket.

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