West Indies cricket July 21, 2013

Fatigue a factor in West Indies' deterioration

West Indies cricket may be suffering in the ODIs due to a lack of basic work, but fatigue may also be pulling down players like Chris Gayle, Marlon Samuels and Kieron Pollard
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With every passing ODI over the past eight months - in Bangladesh, India, Australia, England and back in the Caribbean - West Indies' problems multiply.

They concern primarily the change of the captaincy and the overall batting failures that have resulted in all-out totals over the last 23 matches of 199, 132, 171 and 98 and none above 250.

Also high on the list is the failure to recognise the value, especially in a limited-overs contest, of singles and twos so readily available on the vacant spaces created by widespread fields.

As the West Indies pursued their modest goal of 229 against Pakistan at the Beausejour stadium on Friday, they ended with 184 dot balls, those that earned them nothing. They were, by straightforward mathematics, 30.4 overs of their 50; Pakistan had 100 dots fewer.

As Marlon Samuels, especially, soaked up the overs in his tortured 46 from 106 balls, he kept banging balls straight to fielders on the edge of the 30-yard semi-circles so hard that to run would have meant a run-out (not unusual where he is concerned); a simple block would have yielded one. It was thoughtless, unprofessional cricket

The former Australian captain, Bobby Simpson, held the theory that the team with the more singles, rather than the more boundaries, usually wins ODIs. It sounds idiotic on the face of it; the stats and the disruption produced for bowlers and fielders prove otherwise.

The switch of captaincy from Darren Sammy to Dwayne Bravo for the 50-over version in March was, according to chief selector Clyde Butts, to "freshen the leadership". It was prompted by the ODI results (12 losses, nine wins and two ties) that so dramatically contrast the six successive Test victories and the euphoric triumph in last October's World Twenty20 in Sri Lanka.

These are early days but, after the team's elimination from the recent triangular home series with India and Sri Lanka, Bravo openly accepted responsibility, acknowledging that he was still to fit into what is an unfamiliar role at a difficult time.

He is an ebullient all-round cricketer with eight years experience in the international game. Yet his last shot as captain was in South Africa six years ago when he took over for the third and final Test and the five ODIs after Chris Gayle was injured. He has not even led Trinidad & Tobago since.

He said after the triangular series that it was a new role so "I have to get accustomed to it and address it as quickly as possible".

He has taken his responsibility a little far by choosing to bowl the "death" overs himself; the results should persuade him that, as gallant as his decision is, he is not suited to the role.

Against India in Port-of-Spain, he went for 23 off his last two overs; at Beausejour on Friday, his last two cost 32 and very nearly the match.

Bravo has only two more ODIs in charge in this series to fit into the role; the West Indies' next ODIs are scheduled for New Zealand at the end of the year.

The worries are compounded by the decline of the key batsmen, Gayle, Samuels and Kieron Pollard. It constantly places the burden on the tail-enders either to squeeze out a few narrow victories -- or, as was the case at the Beausejour stadium on Friday, an outrageous tie against Pakistan -- or save some face.

Gayle, as feared a striker of a cricket ball as there ever has been, has tapered off to 14 scores below 20 in his last 18 ODI innings.

Samuels has found the certain timing, and the confidence, that made him among the top batsmen in all forms of the game last year elusive, as his struggle on Friday indicated.

Pollard, capable of demolishing opposition bowling as brutally as Gayle, has gone into such a slump that his seven innings since returning home after the Champions Trophy are 0, 4, 0, 0, 3, 30 and 0. Such a sequence so cripples self-belief that it is difficult to break free.

Yet Gayle has an impressive record in all three formats over a dozen years in West Indies colours and an incomparable reputation in Twenty20s the world over.

As recently as March, he was compiling his 15th Test hundred against Zimbabwe before heading off to the 20-overs stuff of the Indian Premier League (IPL) to belt his remarkable, record 175 with 17 sixes for his franchise team, Royal Challengers Bangalore. Just a month ago, he began the triangular series with 109 that underpinned the West Indies victory over Sri Lanka.

Samuels' rare quality was at its peak in 2012; he was not only the West Indies' most productive batsman but was among the world leaders. Pollard has three ODI hundreds, two against Australia home and away, one in India. So why the collective deterioration?

One feasible answer is plain old tiredness. They all certainly look drained.

Gayle, now 33, and Pollard have been virtually non-stop on the road, for the West Indies and for T20 teams in the IPL and Australia's Big Bash, for almost a year.

Samuels was also physically stretched, sidelined with a serious eye injury during the Big Bash and with a muscle strain during the IPL before returning for the Tests against Zimbabwe in March, since when he has been in all West Indies ODIs in Champions Trophy, the triangular and now against Pakistan.

It is instructive that Lendl Simmons has been the freest of the batsmen since his umpteenth recall following his form for the 'A' team against Sri Lanka 'A' in June and that Jason Holder, at 21 the youngest on the team, has made an early impression.

Simmons was not picked for Australia, the Zimbabwe matches or the Champions Trophy. Holder had just two ODIs and the series against Sri Lanka 'A'. Both were fresh and with something to prove. It is clearly an explanation that the selectors, by sticking basically to the same squad throughout, have not bought into.

If it is something else, the West Indies do have a deeper problem than just fatigue.

Tony Cozier has written about and commentated on cricket in the Caribbean for nearly 50 years

Comments have now been closed for this article

  • on July 22, 2013, 5:35 GMT

    Tony, this is a great article, and us fans wish we could see this kind of clarity of thinking from the West Indies organizers. I am not sure we should blame fatigue, as these players would have gained a lot from so much match play, than say, a team like New Zealand when they came to West Indies recently with no recent match play and got their clock cleaned. Gayle seems sluggish, though, and Pollard clearly neede to be left out. And it really doesn't appear that Bravo is up to the task of captaincy. In international cricket the term all rounder should mean that you are a GREAT batsman AND a great bowler, like Gary Sobers. Not mearly good at both things. And Players like Powell, Edwards, Deonarine, Bishoo and Shillingford should be rotated in regularly. These guys are really talented and can make the difference. Selectors don't seem to recognize when certain players aren't firing until it's too late.

  • K_Doc on July 25, 2013, 1:35 GMT

    Tony, I have to disagree. Pollard has poor techniques; a bouncer or spinning ball shows his weakness. Samuels is always consistent; maybe Gayle is overworked. WI lost this Pak vs WI ODI series 3-1 because of DJ Bravo. He is a poor captain, and poorer bowler. He prefers to bowl at the death and is bleeding runs when it matters.

  • everfaithful77 on July 24, 2013, 7:15 GMT

    Tony Cozier has a point but only as far as ROTATION is concerned. Players like Gayle, D.J. Bravo and Pollard have a heavy workload and should have been rested in this series, but that's not an excuse for their poor performances. By sticking to basically the same squad for several ODI's at home and outside a major international tournament, the selectors have robbed themselves and WICB a perfect opportunity to look at the young talented players in the region. Jason Holder and Johnson Charles are the youngest players in the team currently playing Pakistan and they are both giving a good account of themselves. So why aren't the selectors recruiting more young talent like Delorn Johnson, Cummins, Kirk Edwards, Jonathan Carter, Keddy Lesfloris and Ashley Nurse. These players have proven themselves in their regional teams, A-teams and Edwards in tests. In fact the selectors are making a mockery of regional cricket and Windies A-Team by failing to blood these players at international level.

  • westindiesupporter on July 23, 2013, 5:15 GMT

    We can't hide our bad results by blaming us being weary or fatigued.We first need to drop players like Devon smith and pollard who make the team one of 9 players.We need more specialist players rather than all -rounders.We need to win the World Cup in 2015.

  • on July 22, 2013, 19:32 GMT

    Has Mr Cozier asked the nurses, teachers, doctors, construction workers etc, if they are suffering from fatigue working at their jobs. Is Mr Cozier suffering from fatigue, having spent so many years at his job. It only serves to make him a top class commentator! Cricket is not a sport any more, its a job - professionals- and if one cannot perform , just like any other jobs, then that one has to be terminated. The problem with WI batsmen, they are lacking technique, application and cricket sense. The crux of the problem is to be found at the cricket academy! What are the coaches coaching? Baseball! One just has to watch Jonson Charles. He stands on the leg stump and swats at balls. That is the style of baseball - feet do not move. Charles and many morel ike him will have problems playing the moving ball. Instead of watching video clips of baseball players, they should be watching clips of Haynes, Greenidge, Gavaskar, Gomes, Devilles, Amlar, Bell, Sangakara ,Cooke and Trott.

  • on July 22, 2013, 18:48 GMT

    It's not tiredness..... Tiger Paul never get tired he should have been in the 11. Sarwan and Narsingh Deobarine should also be or rotate in the 11.

  • SNIFFLEATHER on July 22, 2013, 16:25 GMT

    There are plenty good enough players throughout the region to not rely on the same 13/14 guys time and again. The selectors need to understand the importance of blooding young players earlier. Delorn Johnson tore through a decent India 'A' last year, yet Rampaul and Fidel Edwards were mistakenly selected over him - crazy. Now, young Miguel Cummins has blasted all in front of him and guess what? No sign of his selection either. Get a grip selectors, time to put the life back into the pitches AND the team. Roach, Best, Holder, Johnson and Cummins are a fine pack of quickies - but they need managing in the correct manner.

  • on July 22, 2013, 14:48 GMT

    The best WestIndies one day batting lineup 1. K Powell, 2 L.Simmons 3. DM Bravo, 4. M Samuel, 5. C Gayle, 6. J Charles, 7. N. Deonaraine (Capt), 8. D Sammy.9. S Shillingford, 10. K.Roach, 11. J. Holder, 12. R.Rampaul.

  • Impostor on July 22, 2013, 11:48 GMT

    I, also disagree that fatigue is the cause of WI poor showing. I keep on reading about how talented these players are, and I have looked at them for years, but yet to see any talent. True, at times, they have shown brilliance, but consistency is the key element to judge talent. None of them has show consistency. The simple reason is that they all lack the proper techniques. Every player will at some time go through a slump and it is usually at this time that the good players fall back on sound techniques. No foundation means a losing struggle. They have not even developed the art of reading spin in the air and off the pitch. All concentration is used to just watch the ball. This means playing the ball late and where-ever it goes, it goes. If you can't read the spin, you won't pick the gaps, hence, another dot ball. The fast bowlers have not realized yet that the key to swing bowling is by maintaining an upright seam, not blazing speed. Imparting rotation will help seam to stay upright.

  • on July 22, 2013, 11:21 GMT

    Intresting comparison between Sameuls and Sangakara they both debuted in same year and look at there stats. Sangakara Test and one day debut year 2000

    Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 4s 6s Ct St Tests 117 200 16 10486 287 56.98 19428 53.97 33 42 1292 36 169 20 ODIs 350 327 35 11595 169 39.70 15187 76.34 16 77 1108 65 344 84 T20Is 43 41 5 1080 78 30.00 893 120.94 0 6 110 16 20 17

    Samuels Test and one day debut year 2000

    Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 4s 6s Ct St Tests 46 80 6 2767 260 37.39 5702 48.52 5 18 373 21 21 0 ODIs 153 143 22 3754 126 31.02 5133 73.13 5 22 372 66 42 0 T20Is 23 21 3 584 85* 32.44 426 137.08 0 6 35 38 6 0

  • on July 22, 2013, 5:35 GMT

    Tony, this is a great article, and us fans wish we could see this kind of clarity of thinking from the West Indies organizers. I am not sure we should blame fatigue, as these players would have gained a lot from so much match play, than say, a team like New Zealand when they came to West Indies recently with no recent match play and got their clock cleaned. Gayle seems sluggish, though, and Pollard clearly neede to be left out. And it really doesn't appear that Bravo is up to the task of captaincy. In international cricket the term all rounder should mean that you are a GREAT batsman AND a great bowler, like Gary Sobers. Not mearly good at both things. And Players like Powell, Edwards, Deonarine, Bishoo and Shillingford should be rotated in regularly. These guys are really talented and can make the difference. Selectors don't seem to recognize when certain players aren't firing until it's too late.

  • K_Doc on July 25, 2013, 1:35 GMT

    Tony, I have to disagree. Pollard has poor techniques; a bouncer or spinning ball shows his weakness. Samuels is always consistent; maybe Gayle is overworked. WI lost this Pak vs WI ODI series 3-1 because of DJ Bravo. He is a poor captain, and poorer bowler. He prefers to bowl at the death and is bleeding runs when it matters.

  • everfaithful77 on July 24, 2013, 7:15 GMT

    Tony Cozier has a point but only as far as ROTATION is concerned. Players like Gayle, D.J. Bravo and Pollard have a heavy workload and should have been rested in this series, but that's not an excuse for their poor performances. By sticking to basically the same squad for several ODI's at home and outside a major international tournament, the selectors have robbed themselves and WICB a perfect opportunity to look at the young talented players in the region. Jason Holder and Johnson Charles are the youngest players in the team currently playing Pakistan and they are both giving a good account of themselves. So why aren't the selectors recruiting more young talent like Delorn Johnson, Cummins, Kirk Edwards, Jonathan Carter, Keddy Lesfloris and Ashley Nurse. These players have proven themselves in their regional teams, A-teams and Edwards in tests. In fact the selectors are making a mockery of regional cricket and Windies A-Team by failing to blood these players at international level.

  • westindiesupporter on July 23, 2013, 5:15 GMT

    We can't hide our bad results by blaming us being weary or fatigued.We first need to drop players like Devon smith and pollard who make the team one of 9 players.We need more specialist players rather than all -rounders.We need to win the World Cup in 2015.

  • on July 22, 2013, 19:32 GMT

    Has Mr Cozier asked the nurses, teachers, doctors, construction workers etc, if they are suffering from fatigue working at their jobs. Is Mr Cozier suffering from fatigue, having spent so many years at his job. It only serves to make him a top class commentator! Cricket is not a sport any more, its a job - professionals- and if one cannot perform , just like any other jobs, then that one has to be terminated. The problem with WI batsmen, they are lacking technique, application and cricket sense. The crux of the problem is to be found at the cricket academy! What are the coaches coaching? Baseball! One just has to watch Jonson Charles. He stands on the leg stump and swats at balls. That is the style of baseball - feet do not move. Charles and many morel ike him will have problems playing the moving ball. Instead of watching video clips of baseball players, they should be watching clips of Haynes, Greenidge, Gavaskar, Gomes, Devilles, Amlar, Bell, Sangakara ,Cooke and Trott.

  • on July 22, 2013, 18:48 GMT

    It's not tiredness..... Tiger Paul never get tired he should have been in the 11. Sarwan and Narsingh Deobarine should also be or rotate in the 11.

  • SNIFFLEATHER on July 22, 2013, 16:25 GMT

    There are plenty good enough players throughout the region to not rely on the same 13/14 guys time and again. The selectors need to understand the importance of blooding young players earlier. Delorn Johnson tore through a decent India 'A' last year, yet Rampaul and Fidel Edwards were mistakenly selected over him - crazy. Now, young Miguel Cummins has blasted all in front of him and guess what? No sign of his selection either. Get a grip selectors, time to put the life back into the pitches AND the team. Roach, Best, Holder, Johnson and Cummins are a fine pack of quickies - but they need managing in the correct manner.

  • on July 22, 2013, 14:48 GMT

    The best WestIndies one day batting lineup 1. K Powell, 2 L.Simmons 3. DM Bravo, 4. M Samuel, 5. C Gayle, 6. J Charles, 7. N. Deonaraine (Capt), 8. D Sammy.9. S Shillingford, 10. K.Roach, 11. J. Holder, 12. R.Rampaul.

  • Impostor on July 22, 2013, 11:48 GMT

    I, also disagree that fatigue is the cause of WI poor showing. I keep on reading about how talented these players are, and I have looked at them for years, but yet to see any talent. True, at times, they have shown brilliance, but consistency is the key element to judge talent. None of them has show consistency. The simple reason is that they all lack the proper techniques. Every player will at some time go through a slump and it is usually at this time that the good players fall back on sound techniques. No foundation means a losing struggle. They have not even developed the art of reading spin in the air and off the pitch. All concentration is used to just watch the ball. This means playing the ball late and where-ever it goes, it goes. If you can't read the spin, you won't pick the gaps, hence, another dot ball. The fast bowlers have not realized yet that the key to swing bowling is by maintaining an upright seam, not blazing speed. Imparting rotation will help seam to stay upright.

  • on July 22, 2013, 11:21 GMT

    Intresting comparison between Sameuls and Sangakara they both debuted in same year and look at there stats. Sangakara Test and one day debut year 2000

    Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 4s 6s Ct St Tests 117 200 16 10486 287 56.98 19428 53.97 33 42 1292 36 169 20 ODIs 350 327 35 11595 169 39.70 15187 76.34 16 77 1108 65 344 84 T20Is 43 41 5 1080 78 30.00 893 120.94 0 6 110 16 20 17

    Samuels Test and one day debut year 2000

    Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 4s 6s Ct St Tests 46 80 6 2767 260 37.39 5702 48.52 5 18 373 21 21 0 ODIs 153 143 22 3754 126 31.02 5133 73.13 5 22 372 66 42 0 T20Is 23 21 3 584 85* 32.44 426 137.08 0 6 35 38 6 0

  • on July 22, 2013, 5:14 GMT

    Pakistan can still improve more if they change their batting order. Umar Akmal should bat at No.3, he is one of the best to maintain run rate. He should be given more time to bat. Hafeez should bat down the order.

  • BravoBravo on July 22, 2013, 3:59 GMT

    Congrats to PAK. Besides WI, I have always been fan of PAK team. In todays game luck favored to PAK to certain extent. Don't mean to take away the due credit to PAK. I enjoyed the 3rd ODI very much, it was absolute thriller with perfect ending. I hope that WI win the final ODI, that will be perfect ending of series between the two most entertaining teams. I like to see Gayle clicks, but Gayle is becoming a BB McCullum, they just shine in one game per year, rest of the time they cash on their one-game glory.

  • on July 22, 2013, 3:39 GMT

    Pollard never had any technique and will never be a player, remember Ricardo Powell? He was supposed to be the next Carl Hooper and it never worked. Hav e to agree with TYPOS, what is the logic is playing Devon Smith but leave out Chiv, this must personal. Cant be no other reason. I supported Gibson and his methods when he just arrived and even defended him, but what he is doing now makes me rather upset. Where is Powell & Edwards? why are they not in and have this time waster Pollard in the squad? They need to stop this all rounder rubbish and get genuine bowlers and batsmen unless that player really merits a place like Sammy. Gibson was the one to insist on using these player yet they cant make a ODI sqaud?. His selections continue to baffle me, and Bravo and his crappy death bowling needs to stopped. The last two games he and Pollard gave away and cost the team so much runs. Better planning must go into the games and i'm sorry Bravo just does not have it.

  • vannoj on July 22, 2013, 1:47 GMT

    Good win for Pakistan. Who need rest. that is their job: meaning the West Indies?. By the way has anyone check Bravo bowling record for the series so far. Why on earth is he bowling all those unproductive overs with an economy rate of 6.44, the worst for a West Indian, which is the worst for any bowler on either side.

  • aclarity on July 22, 2013, 0:50 GMT

    The WI selector's strategy is clear. This is the team they want to groom for the 2015 World Cup with Dwayne Bravo as captain. But Bravo cannot bowl and he can't make it as a batsman. In the last 12 ODI's and with a losing record Simmons was the only new player. He was introduced by default. So the strategy of WI is to hammer these existing losers into winners without looking for alternatives. Give no one else experience . Where are K. Edwards, Carter, Powell, Gabriel, Beaton, Cottereal and Walton? This was a wonderful opportunity to try them. I hope they are not used for the T20. I repeat Fire the selectors and the Coach now!!

  • sohaibahmad on July 22, 2013, 0:19 GMT

    What about a fresh team for the last ODI, drop all the IPL players alongwith players who are pkaying non-stop for months (whether performing or not)...

  • on July 22, 2013, 0:05 GMT

    The problem is not playing Chanderpaul , Sarwan , Narsingh and playing ever failing Pollard , Devon smith and never learning not to bowl short ball Tino best . These three guys have fail and will continue to fail but as all most of the comments stated the selectors and management will continue with the same team because I guess they can think better or they don't know better .

  • bajan0123 on July 21, 2013, 23:02 GMT

    I don't think fatigue has anything to do with the failure of the WI batsman. The lack of basic foot movement is the problem especially against good seamers. Playing with the bat away from the body and not moving your feet is a recipe for failure. what is the purpose of dropping Gayle down the order and opening with Devon Smith? Devon Smith is absolutely pathetic. He has been given too many chances and has done nothing to help this team. Why is Kraig Brathwaite and Kirk Edwards not in this side? The are both quality batsman that can strengthen the batting. They are both better batsmen than Devon Smith and Pollard. Gayle need to work on his foot work, every match is not a t20 match. Each of the formats require the batsmen to adjust. If Gayle is to be dropped down the order, then they should bring in an opening batsman that can bat through innings and take the pressure off the middle order. For me it should be Brathhwaite. Edwards should bat at 3 or 4 for the WI.

  • on July 21, 2013, 22:59 GMT

    I felt sorry for captain bravo look at the team selection, also this is the worst coach WI ever had said Shiv in the local news paper in Guyana. We in WI must have an overseas coach cause we have different race of people in the West Indies and its only going one way.

  • typos on July 21, 2013, 22:51 GMT

    Where is Powell? Barath and Edwards were dropped for not really failing yet guys like DS Smith at his age are brought back. Even the other Smith seems to have been forgotten. Pollard deserves his drop and I'm still not convinced that DM Bravo is an ODI player let alone worth a number 3 spot. The selectors really need to come up with a proper vision for what they want and who can get them there since their vision continues to exclude Chanderpaul but include DS Smith. In my opinion, people need to be given an extended run and when they fail, it's adios, no matter what happens in regional cricket, since after age 30, very few (Marlon being the exception) seem to re-align an international career. They should also insist guys like Pollard actually play first class cricket at home if they are to make the team since his technique has gone and must be rediscovered by playing proper extended cricket.

  • on July 21, 2013, 22:21 GMT

    The WICB is not using enough players from the West Indies A team to rotate the players into the final 11. Maybe players such get 'mandatory rest' after a 'specified number of games within a specified period'.

  • Sports4Youth on July 21, 2013, 22:18 GMT

    http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/bowling/most_wickets_career.html?id=8245;type=series

    Both Afridi & Hafeez have bowled 29 overs each in this series. Their economy rates are quite similer. Afridi 3.62 runs per over and Hafeez 3.24 runs per over. I would say both are specialist bowlers becouse Narine who is a spcialist bowler has an economy of 4.89 runs per over in the same series.

    But the big difference between HAFEEZ & AFRIDI is the number of wickets in this serries. Afridi has collected 10 wickets @ 10.5/wicket Whereas Hafeez has been wicketless in this series. THat is a big difference according to me.

    As far as runs are concerned Hafeez has scored 94 runs at a strike rate of 70.67/ 100 balls. Whereas Afridi has scored 89 runs at a strike rate of 115.58/100 balls. WHO SAYS AFRIDI SHOULD NOT BE IN THE TEAM?

    .

  • Sports4Youth on July 21, 2013, 22:09 GMT

    BOOM-BOOM is still the leading wicket taker in the series and that too by a good margin. Afridi has taken 10 wickets at an average of 10.5.

  • Sports4Youth on July 21, 2013, 22:07 GMT

    Mr.Wahab Riaz again in the team? why? Riaz has taken 2 wickets in the series at an average of 75, his economy is also poorest from either side of the teams. What does Misbah really expect from him? Or is he just in love with Riaz?

    .

  • SNIFFLEATHER on July 21, 2013, 21:58 GMT

    Why does Bravo insist on bowling his full quota, despite being carted? Yet Sammy is economical and gets three overs...

  • on July 21, 2013, 15:14 GMT

    I have never seen such such brainless management of a cricket team before. These men have a theory, once they are done with you, you are done, if you are favoured you get a millions chances no matter what you do. Look at Pollards score, which team in world cricket would still have him in the team? Yet we persist him. Sarwan was dropped for less, he is just not favoured anymore so id he comes in he better make 50s all the time or its curtain and it was. Not the same rule for Pollard, they love him for some reason at the expense of the team and the captain will defend him too. Best is on the same path now and soon Sammy. If Simmons didnt come and make some runs he would have been gone by now, but Pollard. The golden boy who does nothing continues to enjoy the belief from the WI management. Does it sound like i have a problem with being in the team? You bet i do.

  • DonaldA on July 21, 2013, 14:59 GMT

    I think it's a good idea to move Gayle down the order and drop Pollard. We need to give some of the younger players a chance. Why hasn't Powell gotten a call up?

  • DonaldA on July 21, 2013, 14:45 GMT

    I think it's a good idea to move Gayle down the order and drop Pollard. We need to give some of the younger players a chance. Why hasn't Powell gotten a call up?

  • NCassie on July 21, 2013, 14:22 GMT

    Playing Devon Smith instead of Pollard is not the answer to the batting problems. Yes Pollard deserves a rest but I am sure through out the Caribbean there must be some other batsmen that could be given a chance. Selectors should try to always keep youth around the team, but again the senior men in DJ Bravo, Samuels, Gayle and Roach in the bowling have to lead the team through the tough periods. Our batsmen rely too much on 4's and 6's, they need to keep the score board ticking as there are too many dot balls. WI have to go back to the basics with running between wickets and rotating the strike. Once the top 3 batters get the team off to a good start and a solid foundation the guys like Pollard & Sammy can come in and play their natural game. WI have to raise the bar a bit and aim to score 250-275 in 50 overs and don't settle to defend 220-230. It just won't be enough against stronger teams.

  • on July 21, 2013, 13:17 GMT

    no tony ! they are not and should not be drained ...india has played more cricket ...india has been winning matches ...the west indian batsmen dont have proper batting techniques so most of them become cannon fodder for quality seam and spin ...if this continues ..gayle pollard and captain bravo will all be seeing thier last days in international cricket

  • CricketChat on July 21, 2013, 12:57 GMT

    How can Gayle and Pollard be suffering from fatigue when they no more than 10 balls per match these days? Gayle hardly bowls these days while Pollard hardly bowls more than 4/5 overs per match. If at all, one can say they are fatigued with the tension of not making any contribution to the team at all! After looking clueless while batting in the Champions Trophy and early part of recent ODI tri-series, he seems to be finding his touch a bit. WI must encourage new players instead of persisting with tried and failed players. They should follow the example of India, who after years of timid approach, are slowly but surely reaping the benefits of trying new talent.

  • Cameronburt96 on July 21, 2013, 9:17 GMT

    West indies need to add two players who score lots of 1s and 2s, along the lines of ab de villiers, and -when at his best - shoaib malik. Darren bravo is claimed to be the solid, anchor batsman, but even he has problems with strike rotation. Shiv chanderpaul and ramnaresh sarwan are still class players who have the technique and adaptability to play such a role, if asked. For me the best west indies team for the rest of the series would be:

    Charles, chanderpaul, Darren bravo, sarwan, Samuels, Simmons, dwayne bravo, sammy, roach, holder and narine.

    The absence of gayle and pollard from this team is not to drop, but rest them, as I agree with cozier, they could do with a break.

  • SNIFFLEATHER on July 21, 2013, 9:16 GMT

    Indeed, freshening the leadership is a good idea - especially with the constant limited overs schedule that seems never ending. West Indies needed to make a few changes with the squad though, and as so often - didn't. Younger players such as Johnson Charles and Jason Holder have come in and done well, yet the backbone has remained Gayle, Samuels and Pollard. All three look in need of a rest and should not have been considered for the second leg of this ODI jaunt. Simmons is a decent opener, perhaps he and Charles should have been at the top of the order, with Fudadin or Edwards brought into the middle order. The Big Bash, IPL, Champions Trophy, Tri-Nation series and ODI series is a long list - too long, and damaging for our cricket. Time to regard most of this limited overs cricket as secondary, and select more fringe players. Otherwise, some of our players will be too drained to excel in the longer format, when the test matches eventually arrive. Only Chanderpaul gets a proper rest.

  • SNIFFLEATHER on July 21, 2013, 9:16 GMT

    Indeed, freshening the leadership is a good idea - especially with the constant limited overs schedule that seems never ending. West Indies needed to make a few changes with the squad though, and as so often - didn't. Younger players such as Johnson Charles and Jason Holder have come in and done well, yet the backbone has remained Gayle, Samuels and Pollard. All three look in need of a rest and should not have been considered for the second leg of this ODI jaunt. Simmons is a decent opener, perhaps he and Charles should have been at the top of the order, with Fudadin or Edwards brought into the middle order. The Big Bash, IPL, Champions Trophy, Tri-Nation series and ODI series is a long list - too long, and damaging for our cricket. Time to regard most of this limited overs cricket as secondary, and select more fringe players. Otherwise, some of our players will be too drained to excel in the longer format, when the test matches eventually arrive. Only Chanderpaul gets a proper rest.

  • Cameronburt96 on July 21, 2013, 9:17 GMT

    West indies need to add two players who score lots of 1s and 2s, along the lines of ab de villiers, and -when at his best - shoaib malik. Darren bravo is claimed to be the solid, anchor batsman, but even he has problems with strike rotation. Shiv chanderpaul and ramnaresh sarwan are still class players who have the technique and adaptability to play such a role, if asked. For me the best west indies team for the rest of the series would be:

    Charles, chanderpaul, Darren bravo, sarwan, Samuels, Simmons, dwayne bravo, sammy, roach, holder and narine.

    The absence of gayle and pollard from this team is not to drop, but rest them, as I agree with cozier, they could do with a break.

  • CricketChat on July 21, 2013, 12:57 GMT

    How can Gayle and Pollard be suffering from fatigue when they no more than 10 balls per match these days? Gayle hardly bowls these days while Pollard hardly bowls more than 4/5 overs per match. If at all, one can say they are fatigued with the tension of not making any contribution to the team at all! After looking clueless while batting in the Champions Trophy and early part of recent ODI tri-series, he seems to be finding his touch a bit. WI must encourage new players instead of persisting with tried and failed players. They should follow the example of India, who after years of timid approach, are slowly but surely reaping the benefits of trying new talent.

  • on July 21, 2013, 13:17 GMT

    no tony ! they are not and should not be drained ...india has played more cricket ...india has been winning matches ...the west indian batsmen dont have proper batting techniques so most of them become cannon fodder for quality seam and spin ...if this continues ..gayle pollard and captain bravo will all be seeing thier last days in international cricket

  • NCassie on July 21, 2013, 14:22 GMT

    Playing Devon Smith instead of Pollard is not the answer to the batting problems. Yes Pollard deserves a rest but I am sure through out the Caribbean there must be some other batsmen that could be given a chance. Selectors should try to always keep youth around the team, but again the senior men in DJ Bravo, Samuels, Gayle and Roach in the bowling have to lead the team through the tough periods. Our batsmen rely too much on 4's and 6's, they need to keep the score board ticking as there are too many dot balls. WI have to go back to the basics with running between wickets and rotating the strike. Once the top 3 batters get the team off to a good start and a solid foundation the guys like Pollard & Sammy can come in and play their natural game. WI have to raise the bar a bit and aim to score 250-275 in 50 overs and don't settle to defend 220-230. It just won't be enough against stronger teams.

  • DonaldA on July 21, 2013, 14:45 GMT

    I think it's a good idea to move Gayle down the order and drop Pollard. We need to give some of the younger players a chance. Why hasn't Powell gotten a call up?

  • DonaldA on July 21, 2013, 14:59 GMT

    I think it's a good idea to move Gayle down the order and drop Pollard. We need to give some of the younger players a chance. Why hasn't Powell gotten a call up?

  • on July 21, 2013, 15:14 GMT

    I have never seen such such brainless management of a cricket team before. These men have a theory, once they are done with you, you are done, if you are favoured you get a millions chances no matter what you do. Look at Pollards score, which team in world cricket would still have him in the team? Yet we persist him. Sarwan was dropped for less, he is just not favoured anymore so id he comes in he better make 50s all the time or its curtain and it was. Not the same rule for Pollard, they love him for some reason at the expense of the team and the captain will defend him too. Best is on the same path now and soon Sammy. If Simmons didnt come and make some runs he would have been gone by now, but Pollard. The golden boy who does nothing continues to enjoy the belief from the WI management. Does it sound like i have a problem with being in the team? You bet i do.

  • SNIFFLEATHER on July 21, 2013, 21:58 GMT

    Why does Bravo insist on bowling his full quota, despite being carted? Yet Sammy is economical and gets three overs...

  • Sports4Youth on July 21, 2013, 22:07 GMT

    Mr.Wahab Riaz again in the team? why? Riaz has taken 2 wickets in the series at an average of 75, his economy is also poorest from either side of the teams. What does Misbah really expect from him? Or is he just in love with Riaz?

    .