West Indies in India 2011-12 December 4, 2011

West Indies must learn to win again

In every single match in India so far, West Indies have built up their supporters only to let them down by converting surprisingly strong positions into four defeats and one tie-draw
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As popular and appropriate as it was at the time, David Rudder's converted anthem Rally Round the West Indies is wearing a little thin for cricket supporters despairing over whether there will ever be a revival.

Perhaps the more apt chorus would now come from The Foundations' hit of the late 1960s, Buttercup. Why do you build me up … just to let me down and mess around.

It has certainly been, once again, the theme in the current Tests and ODIs in India where, in every single match, the inexperienced West Indies have built us up only to let us down by converting surprisingly strong positions into four defeats and one tie-draw.

It is not a new phenomenon, although more pronounced, and thus more frustrating, over the past month or so. There have been several individual "positives", to use the favourite noun of all captains and coaches, but they are diminished by the results and the manner of them.

Darren Bravo confirmed his promise as a star of the future. Kirk Edwards' consistency at No.3 proved that his debut Test hundred in Dominica in July was no one-innings wonder. Marlon Samuels' now sanctioned off-spin has given the bowling a new dimension.

Ravi Rampaul maintained the form that made him the outstanding bowler in the Caribbean earlier in the year and there are gradual signs that Kemar Roach is regaining the confidence and penetration that made him such an effective leader of the attack on his entry into the team.

Without piling up big runs, Kraigg Brathwaite, 18, and Kieran Pollard, 21, showed they were more than just boys in a big man's world, showed their potential as batsmen with the potential for long and productive futures.

So why did West Indies repeatedly squander winning positions? Why did first-innings leads of 95 in the first Test and 108 in the third end in defeat in the first instance, a scrambled tie-draw in the second when a first innings total 590 was followed by a second innings 134?

The same questions could be repeated for the two ODIs to date.

In the first one-dayer, the pace of Roach and Andre Russell left India lurching at 59 for five in reply to a seemingly inadequate 211, only for them to recover and, finally, for the last pair to squeeze out the last 11 runs for victory by one wicket. West Indies helped them along with 16 wides and four no balls (each worth a free hit) in 23 extras, crippling statistics in a low-scoring match.

In the second, Rampaul's extraordinary record 66-ball, unbeaten 86 at No.10 and his last wicket partnership of 99 with the unruffled Roach was followed by India faltering at 84 for three in the 17th over. West Indies had reason to be bouyant but the balloon soon burst. They missed four catches, and flawed tactics subsequently allowed Virat Kohli (the same batsman whose dislike of bodyline bowling had been exposed in the Caribbean) and Rohit Sharma to comfortably gather singles to the deep-set fields. Inevitable victory was achieved with five wickets and 11 balls to spare.

West Indies "seemed to be trapped in a mindset that dooms them to failure". It is not a condition easily resolved.

So why does it all go so wrong so often?

To be sure, the failures with the bat of the wicketkeepers, Carlton Baugh and Denesh Ramdin, at No. 7 and captain Darren Sammy at No. 8, repeatedly opened the door to late order collapses. The bowling often went flat once the ball lost its shine and hardness.

To state that Chris Gayle's hypothetical inclusion would have been a boost of experience and proven record is to state the obvious, but it wasn't much different when he was in the XI.

The reasons for such stunning reversals go beyond cricket alone. As Harsha Bhogle, the writer and commentator, put it after the first Test, West Indies "seemed to be trapped in a mindset that dooms them to failure".

It is not a condition easily resolved. It is a truism applicable to all team sports that losing becomes a habit as much as winning, perhaps even more so.

Floyd Reifer, who is coach of the Barbados champions, University of the West Indies (UWI), and the Combined Campuses and Colleges (CCC) at the regional level, and thus close to young charges, has identified one of his priorities. "Winning is part of development as well," he said recently, recognising that batting, bowling and fielding are not the be all and end all of his remit. "We have to create guys who, when they get into positions to win matches, know how to win them."

It is easier said than done but it must be an urgent priority for all West Indies' coaches, especially at the age-group levels.

Tony Cozier has written about and commentated on cricket in the Caribbean for nearly 50 years

Comments have now been closed for this article

  • johnbarrow on December 5, 2011, 23:26 GMT

    Let Simmons keep wicket. Enough with Ramdin and Baugh.

  • johnbarrow on December 5, 2011, 23:24 GMT

    Great article Tony as usual. Have been following you for over 40 years. How about Simmons as keeper and No7 bat. Russell at 8, followed by Rampaul, Edwards and Bishoo. The first 6 are Barat, Braithwaite, Edwards, Bravo, Chanders, Samuel. Powell just at the outskirts. That would be a great batting and bowling team

  • on December 5, 2011, 13:11 GMT

    Sport remembers winners. and Tony is perfectly right in saying that the WI needs to learn to win. The attitude could be seen when they drew against India the third test match in the carribean and celebrated as if they had won a world cup. They have the firepower but what use is it if does not win matches. They do not believe that they can win matches. Poor and injudicious shots,lack of discipline in bowling and fielding are causing these. In my opinion the 80s winning side were the best side to watch and they had the mental belief and discipline A GOOD winning WI side is what cricket needs

  • PACERONE on December 5, 2011, 12:51 GMT

    AFs_talyarkhan..I think that you should write you notes to yourself.Tony is a great writer and has seen great cricket in his time.He should not be giving the Indian team any credit.He is interested in getting W.I cricket back on track.If he had written a few months back that the Indian team was a joke you would or maybe agreed with him.England made them look foolish.W.I are not doing what it takes to win matches.The world knows that Kholi does not like the short ball at his body...yet we do not pressure him ..easy singles and easy runs with balls pitched where he likes it. Let us see what happens in Australia.Dravid and laxman had better be in their best form..The others cannot cut it against well prepared teams.Australia will catch and field better than W.I. Forget about Sammy and Gayle..there are many good young players in the W.I.We need selectors to select the best team available. Leave Tony alone and worry about your Indian commentators.They were bashing the team a few months back

  • on December 5, 2011, 10:08 GMT

    Sammy should remain the skipper of westindies he should work hard and lead the team from front as Shahid Afridi , M.s Dhoni, Kumar Sangakkara did in worldcup. Westindies have great tallent but they have no temprament. Westindies should be the great team in the future if they utilize their talent properly. Mean while Indians have great talent and they r world champions but they have no great bowling attavk as they world reknowned batsmans. Iam Pakistani but i love how they bat and how they snatch the game from the hands of opposition.

  • on December 5, 2011, 9:54 GMT

    @lugujaga you know nothing about cricket if sammy in your eyes is a fast bowler, AND NO IS ISN'T ONE ON THE BEST FIVE BOWLERS IN THE WI!!!!!!!!!! HE IS AT BEST A MEDIOCRE CLUB CRICKET.

    WANT SOME BETTER BOWLERS RAMPAUL NARINE BADREE BISHOO FIDEL ROACH FIDEL JEROME.

    YOU ARE ALL NARROW MINDED SMALL ISLANDERS WHO ARE SHORT SIGHTED. DARREN GANGA SHOULD HAVE BEEN MADE CAPTAIN TWO YEARS AGO INSTEAD OF SAMMY, I AGREE NOW ITS A BACKWARD STEP. RAMDIN IS FAR BETTER TACTICAL THAN ANYBODY ELSE IN THAT SQUAD ITS HARD WHEN YOU KEEP GOING IN @ 60 FOR 5 ALL THE TIME TO PLAY A GOOD INNINGS

  • muski on December 5, 2011, 8:50 GMT

    Well Tony- Just as winning is a habit loosing is also a habit. Its very difficult to get rid of it. With no offence to Windies cricket, you need to pack of Sammy ASAP. That he is a gentlemen, ever smiling guy is not in doubt. However that is not going to win you matches. Whatever the internal politics of WICB, you need a guy who can command respect from his mates- something that Iam afraid that Sammy is not able to generate given his bits and pieces batting and bowling and costly misses on the field.

  • on December 5, 2011, 8:39 GMT

    Dear Friends from West Indies. Though most of us Indians are fanatic supporters of our national team, you would be pleasantly surprised to know that there are hell of a lot of us who would love to see West Indies succeeding in all forms of Cricket. And also regaining the past glory. When India is not playing, most of Indian Cricket lovers always root for you. Wishing you all the best. You did play so well, in both the 1st & 2nd ODIs,and with a bit of luck, you might even have created some upset results. Luckily for us, we won both. Youngsters from both sides are playing well; and today let the best team win.

  • Bobby_Talyarkhan on December 5, 2011, 8:23 GMT

    Tony Cozier is a legend but I think he is showing signs of boredom/ennui - this is a seriously lazy piece of writing, worthy of a hack getting his copy in before the deadlines rather than a considered piece of analysis from the doyen of West Indian cricket broadcasters. Cozier simply refuses to give the Indian team any credit when it is a fact that, in Indian conditions, the Indian team is well nigh invincible. The West Indians are a promising young team and Cozier's dismissal of their potential will not be of any benefit to them. Tony - if you have got nothing constructive to say - keep quiet! It is not like you need the money - remember quality is more important than quantity.

  • on December 5, 2011, 6:55 GMT

    Tony Cozier has got it all wrong! Instead of blaming the players, he should put the blame where it belongs, in the lap of the WICB. They have to be the most inept cricket board in the game. They have made numerous poor decisions with regard to player selection and tour arrangements. Let's take the 2009 tour of Australia as an example - the WI went to play 3 test matches. They had 1 match to adjust to Aussie conditions. Even though they lost 2-0, they were competitive. The players then had to return to the Caribbean around Xmas, no matches were arranged for them (they did not play any cricket). After Xmas they had to return to Australia for the ODI series. Meanwhile Australia kept playing against Pakistan. So when the WI returned, they were not in cricket-shape. The Aussies were and it showed on the field. How can anyone expect the WI to win in those circumstances? I can't think of any cricket board that would agree to those terms, except ofcourse the WICB!! Where is gayle & taylor!!

  • johnbarrow on December 5, 2011, 23:26 GMT

    Let Simmons keep wicket. Enough with Ramdin and Baugh.

  • johnbarrow on December 5, 2011, 23:24 GMT

    Great article Tony as usual. Have been following you for over 40 years. How about Simmons as keeper and No7 bat. Russell at 8, followed by Rampaul, Edwards and Bishoo. The first 6 are Barat, Braithwaite, Edwards, Bravo, Chanders, Samuel. Powell just at the outskirts. That would be a great batting and bowling team

  • on December 5, 2011, 13:11 GMT

    Sport remembers winners. and Tony is perfectly right in saying that the WI needs to learn to win. The attitude could be seen when they drew against India the third test match in the carribean and celebrated as if they had won a world cup. They have the firepower but what use is it if does not win matches. They do not believe that they can win matches. Poor and injudicious shots,lack of discipline in bowling and fielding are causing these. In my opinion the 80s winning side were the best side to watch and they had the mental belief and discipline A GOOD winning WI side is what cricket needs

  • PACERONE on December 5, 2011, 12:51 GMT

    AFs_talyarkhan..I think that you should write you notes to yourself.Tony is a great writer and has seen great cricket in his time.He should not be giving the Indian team any credit.He is interested in getting W.I cricket back on track.If he had written a few months back that the Indian team was a joke you would or maybe agreed with him.England made them look foolish.W.I are not doing what it takes to win matches.The world knows that Kholi does not like the short ball at his body...yet we do not pressure him ..easy singles and easy runs with balls pitched where he likes it. Let us see what happens in Australia.Dravid and laxman had better be in their best form..The others cannot cut it against well prepared teams.Australia will catch and field better than W.I. Forget about Sammy and Gayle..there are many good young players in the W.I.We need selectors to select the best team available. Leave Tony alone and worry about your Indian commentators.They were bashing the team a few months back

  • on December 5, 2011, 10:08 GMT

    Sammy should remain the skipper of westindies he should work hard and lead the team from front as Shahid Afridi , M.s Dhoni, Kumar Sangakkara did in worldcup. Westindies have great tallent but they have no temprament. Westindies should be the great team in the future if they utilize their talent properly. Mean while Indians have great talent and they r world champions but they have no great bowling attavk as they world reknowned batsmans. Iam Pakistani but i love how they bat and how they snatch the game from the hands of opposition.

  • on December 5, 2011, 9:54 GMT

    @lugujaga you know nothing about cricket if sammy in your eyes is a fast bowler, AND NO IS ISN'T ONE ON THE BEST FIVE BOWLERS IN THE WI!!!!!!!!!! HE IS AT BEST A MEDIOCRE CLUB CRICKET.

    WANT SOME BETTER BOWLERS RAMPAUL NARINE BADREE BISHOO FIDEL ROACH FIDEL JEROME.

    YOU ARE ALL NARROW MINDED SMALL ISLANDERS WHO ARE SHORT SIGHTED. DARREN GANGA SHOULD HAVE BEEN MADE CAPTAIN TWO YEARS AGO INSTEAD OF SAMMY, I AGREE NOW ITS A BACKWARD STEP. RAMDIN IS FAR BETTER TACTICAL THAN ANYBODY ELSE IN THAT SQUAD ITS HARD WHEN YOU KEEP GOING IN @ 60 FOR 5 ALL THE TIME TO PLAY A GOOD INNINGS

  • muski on December 5, 2011, 8:50 GMT

    Well Tony- Just as winning is a habit loosing is also a habit. Its very difficult to get rid of it. With no offence to Windies cricket, you need to pack of Sammy ASAP. That he is a gentlemen, ever smiling guy is not in doubt. However that is not going to win you matches. Whatever the internal politics of WICB, you need a guy who can command respect from his mates- something that Iam afraid that Sammy is not able to generate given his bits and pieces batting and bowling and costly misses on the field.

  • on December 5, 2011, 8:39 GMT

    Dear Friends from West Indies. Though most of us Indians are fanatic supporters of our national team, you would be pleasantly surprised to know that there are hell of a lot of us who would love to see West Indies succeeding in all forms of Cricket. And also regaining the past glory. When India is not playing, most of Indian Cricket lovers always root for you. Wishing you all the best. You did play so well, in both the 1st & 2nd ODIs,and with a bit of luck, you might even have created some upset results. Luckily for us, we won both. Youngsters from both sides are playing well; and today let the best team win.

  • Bobby_Talyarkhan on December 5, 2011, 8:23 GMT

    Tony Cozier is a legend but I think he is showing signs of boredom/ennui - this is a seriously lazy piece of writing, worthy of a hack getting his copy in before the deadlines rather than a considered piece of analysis from the doyen of West Indian cricket broadcasters. Cozier simply refuses to give the Indian team any credit when it is a fact that, in Indian conditions, the Indian team is well nigh invincible. The West Indians are a promising young team and Cozier's dismissal of their potential will not be of any benefit to them. Tony - if you have got nothing constructive to say - keep quiet! It is not like you need the money - remember quality is more important than quantity.

  • on December 5, 2011, 6:55 GMT

    Tony Cozier has got it all wrong! Instead of blaming the players, he should put the blame where it belongs, in the lap of the WICB. They have to be the most inept cricket board in the game. They have made numerous poor decisions with regard to player selection and tour arrangements. Let's take the 2009 tour of Australia as an example - the WI went to play 3 test matches. They had 1 match to adjust to Aussie conditions. Even though they lost 2-0, they were competitive. The players then had to return to the Caribbean around Xmas, no matches were arranged for them (they did not play any cricket). After Xmas they had to return to Australia for the ODI series. Meanwhile Australia kept playing against Pakistan. So when the WI returned, they were not in cricket-shape. The Aussies were and it showed on the field. How can anyone expect the WI to win in those circumstances? I can't think of any cricket board that would agree to those terms, except ofcourse the WICB!! Where is gayle & taylor!!

  • Kirchoffs_law on December 5, 2011, 6:47 GMT

    Good luck to both the teams!! hope Indian openers do not embarrass again :)

  • VivGilchrist on December 5, 2011, 6:41 GMT

    Some are always ready to criticize and blame Sammy, yet they continually support failures like Ramdin and Samuels. Go figure.

  • braindead_rocker on December 5, 2011, 5:35 GMT

    Its unfair to blame Sammy...He's a bowling allrounder...How can his failure at no8 be the reason for the losses? He's been one of their best bowlers on this tour. I think he should continue to get the support he needs.

  • AJGWST on December 5, 2011, 5:33 GMT

    Yes its agreeable, bt WI must be having a difficult time in India, this can be said as India themselves are having trouble coping with their cricket, if not for some heroic innings from Rohit and Virat, INdia would have lost both the matches, lingering at 59/5 and 3/ 84 after a few brilliant spells from the WI bowlers, WI can win, but if India are having trouble then so should WI, they can win the next few matches with an improved batting effort and a maintained bowling effort. Varun Tumuluru - Indian, Jakarta

  • cricket_is_religion on December 5, 2011, 4:55 GMT

    WI team is really getting stronger but i don't think that is enough for them to INDIA beating IND in IND takes more than that.they look good in ODI because IND is playing without SRT,MSD,Yuvi,Zak,Bhajji,praven kumar, but WI guys keeps this performance one day they may beat IND.They have good team spirit is well but team needs performance and consistency

  • Aussierise on December 5, 2011, 4:46 GMT

    though I support Aussies I love to see the WI winning..I think everyone would agree that when the Windies are on song..World Cricket is a better game.I think this article has merit..losing can be a very hard mentality to break.The way I see it (honest truth) is that the current WI only have 3 world class players e.g.players that opposition teams are worried about -Chanderpaul (always values his wicket, hard to get out), D Bravo (plays straight and presents full face of the bat, is a strokemaker), and Rampaul (cunning, clever, and can move the ball around a bit both ways).Of the others Pollard, Barath, Russell, Bishoo have the potential to get into this bracket but have got to work harder, not get injured, and find that elusive consistency in their games (Pollard has to at least get given a fair go in tests...bat at 5/plus handy bowler/great fielder). Gayle is great to watch...but he plays for himself and not the team situation in test matches, Sarwan is talented but simply too lazy.

  • on December 5, 2011, 4:21 GMT

    yesterday IND lost to unknown Belgium in Champions Challenger finals,This W.I. team is similar to IND Hockey team,allowing the opposition to get back and win despite having them on the MAT gasping for breath,,IND hockey were once ruled the world from 1928-1978,W.I. Ruled from 1950-1988,W.I. must thanks IND for allowing them to sneak a chance,I can assure other than IND had they played PAK,AUS or SAF W.I. would not have led in test matches or ran close in ODI's,We INDIANS have always allowed tailenders to fire against us and loose wickets when we are in COMFORT CHASE,see history books,but the effect of DHONI is on the team as they somehow claw back form hopeless situation to win,just see IND team of befor 2006 u shall find 80% they lost after squandering the advantage be it KARACHI test or CAPETOWN ODI of 2006,W.I. are however rebuilding and should thank IND to allow them to run close that too in INDIAN conditions,IRFAN must play in last 2 ODI's rest sehwag and kohli after 3rd ODI win.

  • nyc_missile on December 5, 2011, 4:14 GMT

    Mr.Cozier,there is something called opposition team,you seem to have forgotten that there is one playing at the moment.For all the goof-ups and non-authoritative performances,Indians are still way way better than WI in most departments.If you accept this simple fact,it would be easier to analyze.

  • FairGameFan on December 5, 2011, 3:41 GMT

    Was the team performing better before Sammy was made captain? No. Gayle will return to the team when he gets rid of his foot in mouth disease. Jerome is injury prone (has been injured more often than fit during the last year). Dwayne Bravo overrated as is Marlon Samuels. As for Powell not deserving his place, many WI cricketers made the team on the back of poor regional records Hyatt, Dwayne Smith, Ganga and I can go on. We have bowlers, Shiv, Daren Bravo and Edwards as batsmen. We still need 2 Openers, a #6 batsman, wicketkeeper/batman. Sarwan if fit and willing to work hard (he is lazy) will replace Samuels eventually. As for the wicketkeeper/batman we'll have to recycle failures until some youngster steps up.

  • on December 5, 2011, 3:16 GMT

    WI needs a captain who is enthusiastic, able to motivate others and plays his guts out for his team and the region. Sammy does that, far more than the most recent captains. But Sammy's individual performance, particularly with the bat must improve significantly over the next year. Failure to improve makes a replacement inevitable, and the choice must be Ganga. The team then would be: Braithwaite, Edwards, Bravo, Samuels, Chandrapaul, Ganga, Ramdin, Russell Rampaul, Edwards, Bishoo (or Roach, depending on the venue).

  • on December 5, 2011, 3:13 GMT

    I agree wholeheartedly with the comments made before, the problem with WI cricket transcends the eleven men chosen to represent us on any given field. Until petty politics is uprooted from regional cricket, we will remain in the lower echelon of the international game.

  • timmy33 on December 5, 2011, 1:22 GMT

    in our domestic tournaments,who was the most successful captain recently?why can't shiv. not play odi's?otis gibson,robert hayes,courtney browne,clyde butts & company check their international records less than average when ppl like this run the team what results u get less than average.shiv's average of over 40 in odi's probably is too low that's why he's not in the team(do u think) imagine gibson telling sars how to bat.probably his average is to low too to play.

  • Dravid_Pujara_Gravitas on December 5, 2011, 1:12 GMT

    @all taking objection to my first comment. I completely understand what you guys want - Results. Wins. BUT, please understand that this young Windies team is playing against probably the toughest opponent at home in the History of Cricket. This series result should obviously not be the benchmark to diss this Windies Team or the Captain; is not the right time to talk about winning ways or learning how to win. Ruthless professionals who know nothing but winning couldn't leave their mark here, on our soil - Circa Steve Waugh's Aussies...I thought at least Cozier would raise the point that we are probably the toughest team to beat at home and show some maturity and cut some slack to this Windies Team. I feel sorry for the Windies Team that it is surrounded by critics who are in a haste. Some are worse even driven by parochial mindsets. I'm an Indian Fan who admires Caribbean Cricket. Compare the performance of this Windies with the performance of the English who toured us just last month.

  • on December 5, 2011, 1:02 GMT

    WICB current administration needs to resign for the good of West Indies cricket, every one could see it beside the board?????. Gibson should also go, Sammy is their because they know they could do him what they want, you think they could of do that to Gayle or Chanders

  • Dr_Zeus on December 5, 2011, 0:46 GMT

    I am a St. Lucian and proud to have my fellow countryman as captain of the Windies team. But I must agree that his performance with the bat has been extremely substandard. As to a replacement for him, I do not see that in any of the other players presently on the team. At least he produces with the ball, but to say Ramdin who's wicketkeeping has deteriorated and has never done anything with the bat, is pure rubbish. I think the selectors have to start looking seriously at who they want to replace him....how about Samuels?...how about one of the young guys?...we've been taking chances for so long i do not see that we have anything to lose at this stage...and I like what is happening with this team...they look alot more promising than any team I have seen for the last 15 years...I say we support them and I advise the selectors to start looking into a better performing captain...

  • Silloh on December 5, 2011, 0:31 GMT

    Ganga for captain to replace Sammy ? I don't think so ... maybe if it was earlier but backward step at this stage . We may be better off with Ganga directly on the Administration side or WIPA's new President. I am sure he would support rewards and compensation for the players based on performance and results. That I believe is the main driver why Gayle, Bravo and Pollard perform better when not playing for the Windies. But why is Mr. Cozier's fity years of experience not being shared directly with the WICB where his recommendations may have a greater chance of being considered and implemented ? Maybe because of it being easier said than done.

  • lugujaga on December 5, 2011, 0:23 GMT

    WHY ARE PEOPLE SAYING RAMDIN OR GANGA SHOULD BE THE W.I. CAPTAIN? HA!! HA ! HA. THATS RIGHT IT GIVES ME A BIG CHUCKLE.. I AGREE THAT SAMMY IS NOT PERFORMING WITH THE BAT AS SKIPPER,BUT HE CAN STILL MAKE THE TEAM AS A FAST BOWLER;HOWEVER RAMDIN AND GANGA ARE JUST AS BAD WITH THE BAT IF NOT WORST THAN SAMMY.RAMDIN IS ALSO ON HIS LAST HOORA BECAUSE HE HAS PROVEN TO BE A FAILURE ONCE AGAIN WITH BAT AND GLOVES.DARREN GANGA CANT MAKE THE W.I. TEAM AS BOWLER OR BATSMAN SO UNTIL HE CAN DO THAT NO ONE SHOULD EVEN MENTION HIS NAME AND WEST INDIES IN THE SAME STATEMENT.THE PROBLEM WITH THE W.I. TEAM ARE THE SELECTORS.FOR EXAMPLE WHY WAS SIMMONS DROPPED FOR THE INDIA TEST SERIES AND WHY WAS KIRK EDWARDS DROPPED FOR THE INDIA O.D.I.SERIES.UNTIL THEY GET RID OF THIS STUPID W.I.C.B. THE WEST INDIES TEAM WILL ALWAYS BE SCREWED UP.

  • on December 4, 2011, 23:58 GMT

    WI needs a leader and Sammy has done a good job so far. He has an enthusiam which is contagious and has given hope to long suffering fans. But he has to make tremendous improvement in both his batting and bowling in his next series. Failing to improve and with no obvious leader in sight, turn the team over to Ganga. The team would be: Braithwaite, Edwards, Bravo, Samuels, Chandrapaul, Ganga, Russell, Ramdin, Rampaul, Edwards, Bishoo.

  • on December 4, 2011, 23:33 GMT

    The team is young and inexperienced. They have demonstrated a great deal of fight and resolve to get into the suprisingly strong positions they have against a clearly superior indian outfit. A great deal of what is lacking is on the field strategising to win the match. It may be a situation of capacity.

    Do the captain, vice captain and senior players have it in them to strategise and outfox the opposition on the field of play? I say not. So I humbly suggest, the new captain whenever chosen should have demonstrated capacity as a brilliant strategist in whatever field not necessarily cricket......and if we are going to stick with the trying his best Sammy then lets hire a strategist to help him and the team along the way. No I don't think the coaching team are strategist.

  • WeeBee on December 4, 2011, 23:11 GMT

    Good Luck , Its just the matter of winning break! .. you are so close to win ...

  • TheLight on December 4, 2011, 23:05 GMT

    crickekdebator, based on your comments, you know very little about WI cricket. The difference between the teams losing in the past and the team which Sammy is captaining, is that this current team has GOOD players. Poor Captaincy decisions are being made which leads to our demise and loss. Sammy has set bad fields, made poor bowling rotations and puts himself to bat before the likes of Russell and others who are more capable batsmen than he is.

  • Randy_Wilson on December 4, 2011, 22:48 GMT

    Do people really watch West Indies Cricket? Seriously, I agree to the fact Sammy is unbalancing the TEAM, but When we got Bravo and Gayle in the side, THERE IS NO DIFFERENT, we still Lose anayway, WATCH West Indies Cricket and see what Gayle and co did to it, We hardly win series, this young team is a Fighting team and I give credit to them, WE DONT NEEd gayle and Bravo back, i would support Sarwan and Chander in my team along wiht these new boy, even if we had Gayle in this series, it wouldnt amke a Different, Cricket is NOT A ONE MAN GAME, it's a Team game, Only problem in this Team is Sammy and thats it. Replaced him with Sarwan and it would be a great team.

  • NBRADEE on December 4, 2011, 22:42 GMT

    One must agree with Cozier - since Richie Richardson captained the team, we have so often grabbed defeat as the option in various forms of the game, that we easily remember when we didn't (Brian Lara's teams in the Champions' Trophy 2004, and against Australia in Kensington). What about those instances allowed the team to win? How can that be coached or taught, without a methodology that ensures mental toughness??? I hope that Ganga completes his studies soon in law, and elevates himself to take over from Ramnarine at the lead of the WIPA. Other true professionals need provide technical direction to bring strategic habits on the field, and more innovation off the field in the development of the game and professionals in the Caribbean. A true professional franchise arrangement with players developed and trained for every version of the game is one way to go!!!

  • vish1036 on December 4, 2011, 22:12 GMT

    Sooner or later sammy has to be dropped, its inevitable, what does he bring to captaincy that ramdin cant?? they need to forgive and forget the gayle situation its doin more harm than good...kieran powell opening in a test against india, thats something that even the man himself cant believe, he has done almost nothing regionally to warrant selection...kraigg can atleast occupy the crease but hes not ready yet either...we need gayle he has the power to give us a greater chance to win games, wit simmons in form they could be a great partnership

  • timmy33 on December 4, 2011, 22:08 GMT

    if,wicb wanted a good captain why didn't they choose darren ganga.sammy does'nt have a clue how to captain,ganga would do much better than sammy.wicb is being run by ppl who dont't know about cricket...

  • on December 4, 2011, 22:04 GMT

    way to win drop pathetic sammy make ramdin captain play bishoo and narine

    gayle, barath, simmo, bravo, sars, ramdin, pollard, rampaul, russel,roach, bishoo, narine

  • Cricket-Holic on December 4, 2011, 21:53 GMT

    WI ODI squad period no questions asked; 1)Dwayne Smith 2) Simmons, 3)Samuels, 4)Bravo, 5) K. Pollard, 6) Ramdin, 7) Russell, 8) Rampaul, 9) S. narine, 10) Roach, 11) Stantokie.

    PS; Rampaul & Russell are allrounders let them bat higher.

  • cudjoehead on December 4, 2011, 21:32 GMT

    Sorry, Tony this analysis is superficial and based on wrong assumptions. When West Indies played against Bangladesh recently they converted positions of strength into wins. India is no Bangladesh and some of the credit for the recent wins against West Indies must be attributed to the skill of the Indian players. Quite simply, India is a better team and they are capable of snatching victory from the jaws of defeat when playing against a team as weak as West Indies. For many years now we have simply not had a very good West Indies team.

  • cricketdebator on December 4, 2011, 21:32 GMT

    I agree that Sammy need to contribute more as batsman, but to blame him solely for the team's inability to win, is surely hypocritical. If you look at the facts, during the tests in India, just a few more runs from any of the top six batsmen at various crucial times could have meant the difference between WI winning and losing. In addition the bowlers for most part bowled poorly, and not to mention the WKeeper who contributed little or nothing. I will however be critical of his captaincy especially in the second ODI where he allowed the Indian batsmen so many easy singles where he should have retricted them and force them to take risks in scoring. The problem we are seeing today is not unigue. It was there long before Sammy became captain. Infact it was even worst in the days of Gayle, Sarwan and company, and, like then, the problem is the team's inability to play consistently good cricket for sustained periods, rather than the fault of any individual player. ' Sammy's replacement?????

  • Full-Blooded-Wallop on December 4, 2011, 21:27 GMT

    Why berating this young westindies team, not a single team has won here in the the recent past(excluding SA) Aussies are lagging behind 4-0 in tests in last 3 years, england(with all the great players is 16-1 :P ) Atleast this westindies team is giving a good fight. And I am sure that they will win against other teams like england,pakistan,srilanka and kiwis.

  • on December 4, 2011, 20:52 GMT

    @Georgetown1. I have said several times already on cricinfo that the WICB consists of two members of every member country in the Caribbean. Can you start by asking the two from your country to resign. Just search WICB staff on the net and you will see who you have placed onto the board. Over to you.

  • lakes1 on December 4, 2011, 20:52 GMT

    The West Indies team have been rebuilding for the past 15 years, and when this crop of current young players who is performing good enough, but not a winning combination. in a couple of years they will be deposed the same way Gayle, Sars, Dwayne Bravo, Jerome Taylor, and they tried it with Shiv, but he proved them wrong, so this tells me there is no way up for the West Indies, I am a die hard fan but this is the way I see it. The West Indies will continue to rebuild for another 15 years if this current administration is allowed to destroy our beloved passion.

  • on December 4, 2011, 18:45 GMT

    I agree with Tony Cozier..W.I don't know what it takes to win again...After 15 yrs W.I cricket have been rebuilding,,in the mean time the fans have grown wary and tired of supporting a loosing team..I like Sammy but I love cricket more..Sammy is not an all rounder..he is decent bowler with lots of Spirit..How long will W.I Board continue to let Sammy Caption this team..They quickly dismiss player who have 1 or 2 bad series..we Sammy got more than half a dozen bad series...Mean while Russle have to be benched and W.I Cricket have to suffer ....

  • Nnskrish on December 4, 2011, 18:34 GMT

    @Dravid_Gravitas Sammy needs to improve a lot to be in ODI team....his batting avg of 18 with only 2 fifties in 51 innings and bowling avg of 44 with only 49 wickets in 64 innings with strike rate of 94+ is pathetic for international( any) standards most batsman will have better bowling stats and on top of that he is a captain....I like Sammy but those are pathetic statistics and he is not a gr8 fielder also why is he even in the squad he doesn't deserve to be just because of captaincy....how can he command respect after such poor performances and pathetic stats.He may be their best test bowler but u can't say it for the ODI's.

  • on December 4, 2011, 17:55 GMT

    The problem WI management face with Sammy as captain is the weird way they chose him for the job so now Sammy is not producing every body PRIDE and EGOS are at Stake so they all making excuses that he is a great leader,I do not see any thing in his captaincy and the team performance to suggest there claim we have some excited young players yes . My opinion Sammy must be strip of the captaincy so he can be select when his skill is call for and not been an automatic selection. Tony is my legendary alltime commentator but Tony at present is the longest employee of WI Cricket so he is not going to be to hard on WICB.

  • on December 4, 2011, 17:53 GMT

    the reference to kieran pollard should read kieran powell

  • on December 4, 2011, 17:39 GMT

    we need shiv,sars,gayle an dwyane. its simple as dat. de young guns r doin ok but need de experience of de old men to guide dem

  • gloriouscricket on December 4, 2011, 16:59 GMT

    Seamers with the skill of Santokie along with Narine & Dwayne Smith can make the difference here in winning the 3rd.ODI. Samuels seems to have lost his confidence, he is an integral part of this team : WI will not win with his underperforming. Replace him with Edwards,Sammy sits for Smith while we find a spot for Narine and Santokie.Almost is not good enough---this team needs to win for the fans.Bravo must be more alert in the field, catches are as important as runs in order to win.

  • Ghost_Recon on December 4, 2011, 16:50 GMT

    The man (Sammy) is just unbalancing this West Indies team because he is Captain.......I hope he sit's out the rest of the one dayer's and let us see what happens..

  • on December 4, 2011, 16:33 GMT

    WICB along with the manager and selectors are people who have no knowledge of what winning feels like so to get my point u must have some talent to know who is talented at best the selectors along with the manager were third class or average players let me select my test team for the next few years Gayle Barath D.Bravo captain Shiv Daren Bravo Samuels Ramdin K roach F edwards Bishoo J taylor Russel this is ur test team u fail after two matches become water boy and soon after out u go try to play ur self back in the team by performing well at first class level your thoughts

  • on December 4, 2011, 16:27 GMT

    Hope WI will be close to competitive.Test Cricket is played by just handful of Nations and strong WI will be g8 news for the game. But the sad thing is I dont see anything close to that happen for another decade!

  • Nampally on December 4, 2011, 16:26 GMT

    Tony, it is tough to beat India on Indian soil. The confidence of the Indian players has got to do a lot with it. WI had upper hand a few times but could not press home the advantage. In the last match several dropped catches at crucial stages let the Indian batsmen recover from poor situation. So Rampaul's heroics went for naught being countered by Kohli & Sharma. If there is one factor missing in WI, it is the experience. Fortunately for WI, Sehwag & Gambhir were in very poor form in the first 2 ODI's. This is a matter of great concern for India with Aussie tour ahead. These 2 guys are dominanat & experienced ODI players. This factor saved WI bowling lot of heart aches. The second factor that may have helped the WI team is facing the same bowlers in both the ODI's. India has good leg spinner in Rahul Sharma who was superb in IPL T-20 & will be a force in ODI's.His bowling can create new problems not yet encountered.WI talent with some experience will convert into Victories soon.

  • itsthewayuplay on December 4, 2011, 16:20 GMT

    Whilst the WI are on the way up and haven't reached thier full potential, they should not have lost the first ODI. In the second they got themselves into a good position but responsible mature innings from Kohli and Sharma saw India through. Consistency is what WI needed and also Sammy'a position in the team is a difficult one. He is a batsman who can bowl a bit but recently has been playing the part of opening bowler whilst not really making runs but he appears to be the right choice as captain. Another pace bowler to go with Rampaul, Edwards and Bishoo and with Sammy back in the runs again then WI would have a more balanced side.

  • Georgetown1 on December 4, 2011, 16:12 GMT

    Excellent question by The Light, how come we are not addressing the issue of a board that has been also failing for the last 15 years. Are they not not held responsible, or are they untouchable. The team has change and their performance have increased, what about change at the Board Level?

  • simonviller on December 4, 2011, 16:12 GMT

    Some of us keep talking about ",when a company fails ,the leadership goes . "We been there and done that ,now what ? Just relax and give peace a chance . Rome was not built in a day and likewise this present young team .

  • chicoguapo on December 4, 2011, 16:07 GMT

    @Davida_Gravitas...did you read the article? did you understand it? I doubt...we are not concerned about lion hearted sammy....what we want is to win matches when we are in winning positions..give our players confidence..not everytime getting there and falling a bit short..that could break the confidence of the players and has...and thus the team...Darren Sammy has done well with the ball, but he is an alrounder, he has to play his role with the bat, we need that, check the record under Sammy, check how many tmes we needed him to make a contribution and he hasnt....A captain cannot only bowl and be positive,...he has to set the example, he has to show his lion-heartedness with the bat or anytime we in a position where he is needed, like to catch, or bat, or make a bowling change...I ADMIT, HE HAS BEEN POSITIVE and kept the guys vibrant, but we need the winning attitude..and that means finishing games...All of us want the same thing, to see Windies cricket rise..

  • noplay on December 4, 2011, 16:06 GMT

    @Dravid_Gravitas Tony Cozier may live in the past, but you live on cloud nine. Thoie individual performances have nothing to do with Sammy's captaincy. Did Sammy look lion-hearted to you at the last post match presentation? He looked pitiful. And to TheLight, the company is not failing, it is making money from Digicel and playing India and Pakistan and savings from low end contracts to players

  • simotalk on December 4, 2011, 16:01 GMT

    Winning is a " business" that the West Indies of the recent past have no interest in. Simple accounting tells us that one must deposit more that they withdraw in order to remain debt free. Habits become character, character becomes destiny.

    One glance at the leadership (including the board and captian) and you will realize that mediocracy is a common theme. Never is the history of the game has a captian's appointment been based, not on his abilities and merits of making the team, but rather on the premise that he's a "good" leader. The only team Sammy would make on his abilities and merits is "The Weakest Link".

    Sammy should declare himself injured for the next ODI. There's no doubt that he is mentally unwell when he considers himself an allrounder. His decision to bat ahead of Russell is a captian's decision, made not in the interest of the team, but a result of his mentality....the Board has my back.

    When will we see an injection of sapience in the leadership?

  • Srini_Indian on December 4, 2011, 15:34 GMT

    Tony, the reason they scored 590 in 1st and 134 in 2nd is the wicket was flat as a highway in first and started spinning in 2nd. Its a well known fact that WI have no clue to play spin, so why are you so surprised? Have WI got to a strong position in 2nd test? I hope you are not joking!!!

  • kantipur on December 4, 2011, 15:31 GMT

    @ Dravid_Gravitas , you seem to be fan of Sammy. But because of sammy west indies has lost a lot of matches. Forget about his non existent performance in one dayers. Just look at his fielding. When West indies played Sri lanka in last series Sammy dropped Sangakara which cost west indies the series. When India toured West indies , Sammy dropped Dravid and hence cost west indies the test and consequently the series. Or else west indies would have won the series. When West indies toured india, third test and sammy drops Shewag. Had he taken Shewag early , West indies would have won the test rather than just managing a draw by the skin of the teeth. Even in last one dayers he drops shewag. Can you tell me what is the role of sammy? He couldn't bowl properly to the indian number 10 and 11 which cost west indies the first one day match. His fielding position was shambolic and given too many easy runs after india were 59-5 . He spoils balance of the team.

  • on December 4, 2011, 15:21 GMT

    Our problem, is the fact that we cannot take criticism. Tony Cozier has probably never miss a West indies match since early sixties, he has seen all the greats from Sir Everton, the late Sir Clyde and the late Sir Frank to Darren Bravo and present West Indies Squad, why would you be in a better position than him to see the problem of failure to our team. If you read what he says you can learn from him. He qualifies his statement. Everybody has favourites and most of them don't see anyone else, just like the Indians, you must get past insularity to achieve.Encourage the present squad by reconizing the faults ratherthan so much criticising. Even the Board is quarreling with players too much, while at the same time no paying attention to good management and development.

  • Goneforasix on December 4, 2011, 15:04 GMT

    The Windies are falling into the "Bangladesh" trap, where the best case expectation from the team is to compete well. Victory isn't the prime goal and when competing is good enough, that fire required to win isn't apparent on the field.

  • ian_ghose on December 4, 2011, 14:54 GMT

    4 words - 'Gayle in, Sammy out' - should do it easily. @Dravid_Gravy....you're an Indian supporter, aren't you? No wonder you find Sammy's captaincy lion-hearted :p - he helps your team win. One thing that I've enjoyed so far in the ODI series is Sehwag's captaincy! It's refreshing to see a captain who isn't afraid to set attacking fields. His batting might be hit and miss, but his captaincy is really enjoyable.

  • on December 4, 2011, 14:41 GMT

    I think Tony is right on target, I don't how much you know about cricket, but if the big baboons on the west indies board can cast their big egos aside and select a winning combination with experience and youth west indies cricket will continue its losing ways, I don't see where you see lion-hearted leadership of Sammy a guy who cannot bat and take simple catches.

  • on December 4, 2011, 14:37 GMT

    nice article by tony cozier but i wonder why he dint have much to say about the biggest problem right nw .that is darren sammy's inability to bat ,bowl and to captain the side.... the fact windies haven't been able to play its strongest or even balanced side.....if mr sammy is really sincere and passionate about windies cricket then he must realize that he is taking a spot of more deserving player......also simmon can be tried as wicket keeper since he cant do worse than the other keepers....imagine for once this line up.....1.2 .gayle simmon (wkt) ....3 4 5 6.darren bravo sarwan samuels barath ..7.bravo/pollard/russel.......8.tayler 9 rampaul 10.roach 11 bishoo /narine........its not just me but anyone can select a better team then stupid people ruining windies cricket.

  • on December 4, 2011, 14:34 GMT

    'moving forward'? Near wins and getting into winning positions is not moving forward. Tony Cozier's comments reflect on every game WI have played in this series. Which is now. 2011.

  • Silloh on December 4, 2011, 14:30 GMT

    After fifty years as a cricket commentator and writer the views of Mr. Tony Cozier must be respected. Like all scenarios, I may not agree with his views at all times but this has been the exception rather than the rule. For once, we are seeing a more disciplined and committed West Indies team, but performance consistency and concentration for all sessions continue to elude us. I believe this is decreasing and that is positive and encouraging for the team under Sammy's leadership.We can analyse until paralysis steps in but the experienced writers, coaches, past players should not fail to recognise and commend these gains and at the same time , make specific recommendations to address weaknesses. After all, I am in total agreement that it's easier said and done, especially if it's not on the field of play to say winning is part of development as well.The question is what is required to actually make this happen. Just saying such will not really add significant value.

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:50 GMT

    There is a saying that goes "If you do not know your history you are doomed to repeat it". One always refers to historical events to apply to a present day situation, which can have both a posisive and a negative effect, depending on the circumstances. I have mentioned before that the personnel put in place to represent the west indies, must know about its history, its legacy and its destiny. We have had a HISTORY of WINNING, so referring to history every now and then is a good thing, reminding us of our prime reason for being selected to represent the West Indies. As much as I am a fan of Darren Sammy's I cannot defend almost a year of subpar contribuitons from him, for it will start affect his abiltiy to lead the team, and the ability to close out games from winning posiitons. He has tactically gotten it wrong for the second game running. Why set defensive fields for teams against the ropes? History has shown that if you do not knock them out, they will knock you out.

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:46 GMT

    lion-hearted leadership counts for nothing especially when u cant bat bowl or field or set fields......

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:24 GMT

    hi david_gravitas---Pls dont get me wrong but where is windies moving forward......if a team cant turnaround matches and still suffers from the tag "young but learning curve" syndrome then i am afraid theres something wrong with the team...its the mindset which needs clearance.....but the biggest problem windies faces is a lack of "ENFORCERS" guys who can change the game in a couple of overs or runs....the lack of killer instinct and to top it all good strategy....SAMMY is giulty of leaking singles to indian batsmen...in cuttack and vizag...its strategical blunders like these which need 2 be avoided.

  • TheLight on December 4, 2011, 13:10 GMT

    Very good article Tony! I would like to know your view on the WICB also. When a company is failing, the leadership goes, and that is not only limited to the Captain.

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:04 GMT

    West Indian cricketers have lost touch with the fans....what does winning mean for them, their coffers are filled either way. They must once again come to understand what is at stake...the pride of the West Indian people and that we are still very much one nation longing to reign supreme again. Get the boys to interact with the fans. Invite fans to end of practice chats and let them talk to the younger guys. Have the older legends of the past have their time with them also.

  • Dravid_Pujara_Gravitas on December 4, 2011, 12:55 GMT

    Tony Cozier may or may not be a good commentator. But he surely lives in 1970s/80s. Now, he has gone to some tune from 1960s..He is always going back while the Windies Cricket is moving forward under the lion-hearted leadership of Sammy.

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  • Dravid_Pujara_Gravitas on December 4, 2011, 12:55 GMT

    Tony Cozier may or may not be a good commentator. But he surely lives in 1970s/80s. Now, he has gone to some tune from 1960s..He is always going back while the Windies Cricket is moving forward under the lion-hearted leadership of Sammy.

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:04 GMT

    West Indian cricketers have lost touch with the fans....what does winning mean for them, their coffers are filled either way. They must once again come to understand what is at stake...the pride of the West Indian people and that we are still very much one nation longing to reign supreme again. Get the boys to interact with the fans. Invite fans to end of practice chats and let them talk to the younger guys. Have the older legends of the past have their time with them also.

  • TheLight on December 4, 2011, 13:10 GMT

    Very good article Tony! I would like to know your view on the WICB also. When a company is failing, the leadership goes, and that is not only limited to the Captain.

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:24 GMT

    hi david_gravitas---Pls dont get me wrong but where is windies moving forward......if a team cant turnaround matches and still suffers from the tag "young but learning curve" syndrome then i am afraid theres something wrong with the team...its the mindset which needs clearance.....but the biggest problem windies faces is a lack of "ENFORCERS" guys who can change the game in a couple of overs or runs....the lack of killer instinct and to top it all good strategy....SAMMY is giulty of leaking singles to indian batsmen...in cuttack and vizag...its strategical blunders like these which need 2 be avoided.

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:46 GMT

    lion-hearted leadership counts for nothing especially when u cant bat bowl or field or set fields......

  • on December 4, 2011, 13:50 GMT

    There is a saying that goes "If you do not know your history you are doomed to repeat it". One always refers to historical events to apply to a present day situation, which can have both a posisive and a negative effect, depending on the circumstances. I have mentioned before that the personnel put in place to represent the west indies, must know about its history, its legacy and its destiny. We have had a HISTORY of WINNING, so referring to history every now and then is a good thing, reminding us of our prime reason for being selected to represent the West Indies. As much as I am a fan of Darren Sammy's I cannot defend almost a year of subpar contribuitons from him, for it will start affect his abiltiy to lead the team, and the ability to close out games from winning posiitons. He has tactically gotten it wrong for the second game running. Why set defensive fields for teams against the ropes? History has shown that if you do not knock them out, they will knock you out.

  • Silloh on December 4, 2011, 14:30 GMT

    After fifty years as a cricket commentator and writer the views of Mr. Tony Cozier must be respected. Like all scenarios, I may not agree with his views at all times but this has been the exception rather than the rule. For once, we are seeing a more disciplined and committed West Indies team, but performance consistency and concentration for all sessions continue to elude us. I believe this is decreasing and that is positive and encouraging for the team under Sammy's leadership.We can analyse until paralysis steps in but the experienced writers, coaches, past players should not fail to recognise and commend these gains and at the same time , make specific recommendations to address weaknesses. After all, I am in total agreement that it's easier said and done, especially if it's not on the field of play to say winning is part of development as well.The question is what is required to actually make this happen. Just saying such will not really add significant value.

  • on December 4, 2011, 14:34 GMT

    'moving forward'? Near wins and getting into winning positions is not moving forward. Tony Cozier's comments reflect on every game WI have played in this series. Which is now. 2011.

  • on December 4, 2011, 14:37 GMT

    nice article by tony cozier but i wonder why he dint have much to say about the biggest problem right nw .that is darren sammy's inability to bat ,bowl and to captain the side.... the fact windies haven't been able to play its strongest or even balanced side.....if mr sammy is really sincere and passionate about windies cricket then he must realize that he is taking a spot of more deserving player......also simmon can be tried as wicket keeper since he cant do worse than the other keepers....imagine for once this line up.....1.2 .gayle simmon (wkt) ....3 4 5 6.darren bravo sarwan samuels barath ..7.bravo/pollard/russel.......8.tayler 9 rampaul 10.roach 11 bishoo /narine........its not just me but anyone can select a better team then stupid people ruining windies cricket.

  • on December 4, 2011, 14:41 GMT

    I think Tony is right on target, I don't how much you know about cricket, but if the big baboons on the west indies board can cast their big egos aside and select a winning combination with experience and youth west indies cricket will continue its losing ways, I don't see where you see lion-hearted leadership of Sammy a guy who cannot bat and take simple catches.