I can promise there will be a lot of changes in Pakistan cricket - Ehsan Mani

How has the PCB changed over the years since you last represented them? You have been very critical over the years.
The PCB needs to become a professional organisation with specialists running the various departments. There are a lot of good people here and there is no doubt about that, but what I am trying to assess is whether we need to help them with further expertise or not.

So if things are good, then why do you have to push hard for changes?
Things are not that good. They are fine but they could be improved. That is the reason I talked about the constitutional change when I looked at the constitution, and this is before I became a PCB chairman when my name went up for approval.

I saw that the chairman is also a chief executive of PCB. But chairman's role is to head the board that makes the policies, which management is supposed to implement. When a chairman is actually acting as an executive of the board and trying to implement the policy that he and board made, that is a clear conflict of interest.

Because there is no chief executive at the operations level, there are no checks and balances on the chairman, which can't be healthy. I want a board that is transparent and very accountable to stake holders, including the public. You cannot do that if you are wearing two hats. So that is the key reason for me to look at the PCB constitution.

We have a situation where a huge amount of cricket is being played in Pakistan: 16 first-class teams and 16 non-first class teams, so a lot of quantity but not quality. We need to improve the domestic cricket structure and to enable that we need to bring changes in the constitution.

It's not going to happen overnight because it is not only about what I want. We need to study the cost benefit analysis and impact - if we take an action, what does it do to cricket in the country? So one has to think very carefully before making any change, but I can promise you there will be a lot of changes.

How bad are PCB finances?
From what I have gathered so far, it is in reasonable health in spite of not playing India, which is unfortunate. But at the same time, I am concerned whether we are using the PCB's resources in the right way or not: whether they are being used in prime areas that money should be invested, and not in running the PCB or its overheads. So that going to be a big focus for me.

So you cutting resources .. like previous chairmen did?
The PCB runs cricket in the whole of Pakistan; that doesn't happen anywhere in the world. You take England, Australia, India or even South Africa, their cricket associations are the ones who run local cricket affairs. But here the PCB takes care of it and pays the costs. It's not the right way to run cricket.

You are doing an extensive appraisal of PCB officials, is there a plan for the head coach and selection committee too?
As far as cricket is concerned, it is totally wrong for the chairman to be making these decisions on his own. My intention is to set up a cricket committee comprising former cricketers with good reputation who have a better understanding of the game than any chairman, including myself. I don't think this is a role for the operations side of the PCB to do. So there should be a cricket committee that takes all decisions related to cricket.

We have had cricket committees in the past with no powers. Are you going to give it enough power?
The way I envisage it, they will have complete autonomy. There will be certain things that might be referred to the board for its views, but as a whole I will give them autonomy.

How do you see PSL as a product?
It's an excellent product - it was started against all odds on very short notice and a lot of credit to the PCB management to have done that. Now we have to build the brand, we got to take it forward. It's been a great conduit for bringing foreign players to Pakistan and we hope to build on it. We've been playing games in Pakistan, and with every passing year the number of games is increasing and in the near future all games will be played in Pakistan. Eventually, the idea is to bring back all cricket back to Pakistan.

Shahryar Khan once said that Pakistan can survive without playing India. What's your point of view?
Playing against India is not only about money. Money has its own place. Whenever we get money, it affects our viewership and sponsorship. The value of an ICC event in which Pakistan and India are playing each other in the first round is twice as much as the best IPL match. An India-Pakistan match has the highest value financially in the world. The main thing is that we play against each other.

When we play cricket - when we go to India or when they come here - it helps increase people-to-people contact. Lots of fans have come to Pakistan from India and everyone goes back happy. There's no better way to improve relations between countries than having sporting contact, cultural contact. For me, that is far more important than any amount of money.

The Indian public loves to see India and Pakistan playing, and so does the Pakistan public. The rest of the work is for the politicians, and frankly India is in a lead-up to elections next year so I don't think there will be any softening in their attitude. But in the long term, the people want it and you can't go against the will of the people.

For how long can the PCB survive without playing India?
Forever. There is a lot of hypocrisy at the moment; India plays an ICC event against us but not a bilateral series. That is something we need to address. Pakistan can survive without playing India, and financially as well. I've told you before that money isn't the issue, it's more about the game. There are more viewers for an India-Pakistan match than any other match in the world. So, if the Indian government decides to deprive its own citizens of watching an India-Pakistan match then that is their choice.

Had you been PCB chairman at the time, would you have taken this legal route against India for not playing Pakistan?
I would have preferred board-to-board discussions and board-to-government discussions. I was ICC chairman in 2003 and India and Pakistan were not playing each other then. I went and met the Indian government and I took with me the people that were leading the Indian cricket board at that time - Mr. Dalmiya, Mr. Bindra, Mr. Raj Singh - and we went to the different ministries concerned with India-Pakistan cricket relations and they spoke more in favour of resuming cricket between India and Pakistan than I did as a Pakistani. I had to be slightly neutral since I was with the ICC.

There is always some political interference in India but the Indian government has said, "Look, at the end of the day, it is the BCCI's decision to play or not play against Pakistan. But they have to come and present a case to us, and I took them on face value. It took us about a year but they came in 2004 because I kept going back with people on the Indian cricket board and I was going as the ICC president, and not as someone representing Pakistan.

So what if the PCB loses the case, what's the plan going forward?
Cricket has to resume between India and Pakistan at some time. It will have to be accepted that we have toured India far more times than they have played against us at home. That equation will have to be adjusted. Eventually, it will get evened out somehow or the other if it is resumed. If it doesn't get resumed, it will carry on as it is. It is not going to make any major difference to the PCB.

How do you see the PCB's position in the ICC?
I was in the ICC like 12 years ago and Pakistan was a member of every committee and there was no position in the ICC where there was no Pakistani representation. I noticed that we don't have any Pakistani referees on the ICC panel and we have one umpire in the elite panel so we have definitely gone backward. This has to change and it won't happen overnight. We need to enhance performance of our match officials. In terms of our involvement with the ICC, it will depend on more contributions the PCB could make and I will find out more on this.

In domestic cricket, schedules are cramped, pitches are poor, players are overburdened, there's too many teams, and the format changes every year. How can these issues be resolved?
It is my top priority because unless we have a strong domestic system, we are not going to have a sustainable international team. We are looking at the present structure and we know that we want fewer teams to play first-class cricket but a higher quality of cricket. There is a lot of work going on internally by my staff here, people like Mudassar Nazar, Zakir Khan and Haroon Rashid. We are giving shape to what we feel is the best for the future of Pakistan cricket. It won't be for this year or next year but we want to make something that is sustainable over a long period.

You met with Majid Khan about his plan for domestic cricket. How feasible is it and does it fit in with PCB's plans?
Both [Majid and his son Bazid] have been working on it. Their ideas are absolutely superb. Majid understands what Pakistan requires. What I particularly like about his thrust is that it increases the involvement of former players in every cricket association. It will get them jobs, give them career opportunities, so when you finish playing you are involved in running cricket associations and eventually hopefully running the PCB. This whole process comes from the bottom up, rather than the PCB being run by people like myself from outside drafted in. So eventually it's the cricket system that should throw up future leaders.

Are you happy with Pakistan's commitments in the Test Championship and the new FTP?
There are negotiations going on. But clearly I would like to see far more Test cricket for Pakistan. The series with Australia that we playing, I am totally against two-Test match series. They should be playing minimum of three Tests. Pakistan went to England for two games, that is unfortunate.

There have been limited-overs games held in Pakistan. Is there a possibility a side will stay long enough to play a Test in Pakistan?
I have no doubt that Pakistan is safe. Recently a lot of teams came and played cricket and there was no issue. But there is a perception in people's mind, and players have to play in their comfort level so until they have that reassurance it won't be easy, but we are working on that. We are going to work on teams from abroad, whether they are club or school cricketers, or PSL. More people we get from outside, whatever the level, a message goes back that how beautiful the country is and how good people are. So people go back with a good perception, it sends a soft image of the country, and I believe this will work to bring back cricket to Pakistan.